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  • being an illegal alien to be a federal crime?

    Dear all, is this for real?

    Crackdown on immigration

    HOUSE BILL WOULD NOW BE A FEDERAL CRIME


    WASHINGTON - The Republican-controlled House is poised to pass one of the toughest border security measures in more than a decade, cracking down on illegal immigrants and their employers and defying President Bush's call for a comprehensive bill that would grant millions of illegal immigrants already in the United States a right to work here temporarily.

    The measure, expected to clear the House this week, would for the first time make it a federal crime to live in the United States illegally. That provision would turn millions of immigrants into felons, ineligible to win any legal status. Currently, living in the United States without a document such as a visa or a green card is a violation of civil immigration law, not criminal law.

    Immigrant-rights groups have vowed to fight the measures.

    ``We are doing everything in our power to let people know that this is a huge mistake,'' said Marshall Fitz, director of advocacy for the American Immigration Lawyers Association. ``This is an extraordinary change in the way we have treated people in this country.''

    The bill also would broaden the immigrant-smuggling statute to embrace those who shield or offer support to illegal immigrants. Offenders, including employees of social-service agencies and church groups, could face up to five years in prison.

    The legislation would require the mandatory detention, until removal from the country, of non-Mexican immigrants who are entering the United States illegally; would increase financing for sheriffs in border states to allow them to detain illegal immigrants; and would toughen penalties for employers who hire them.

    The proposal, which would require the Department of Homeland Security to expand greatly a fledgling system intended to verify the immigration status of all the nation's employees, has been hailed by many conservatives in Congress as vital to combating illegal immigration and tightening the border with Mexico.

    The bill was approved by the House Judiciary Committee last Thursday. The committee chair, Rep. James Sensenbrenner Jr., R-Wis., said it would ``help restore the integrity of our nation's borders and re-establish respect for our laws by holding violators accountable, including human traffickers, employers who hire illegal aliens and alien gang members who terrorize communities.''

    Critics say it is mean-spirited and makes compassion a crime.

    Cecilia Muñoz, vice president for policy at the National Council of La Raza, a Latino civil rights group, said the bill broadens the definition of smuggling and harboring so much that a church group that finds someone dying of dehydration in the desert and takes him to the hospital could be potentially subject to criminal penalties.

    Most analysts predicting that the leadership's measure will pass in the House on Thursday.

    Meanwhile, some other House Republicans say the Sensenbrenner bill doesn't go far enough to stem the flow of illegal immigrants.

    Rep. Duncan Hunter, R-El Cajon, chair of the House Armed Services Committee, is planning to offer an amendment to build fences at strategic locations along the U.S.-Mexico border.

    Other lawmakers said they would try to offer other amendments, including one that would end birthright citizenship for children of illegal immigrants.

    Many Democrats, including California Rep. Howard Berman of Van Nuys, say conservatives are supporting the House bill solely to gain political points, not out of any belief that it will become law.

    ``There's a lot of anger out there,'' Berman said, ``so rather than solving the problem, they're playing to the cheap seats.''

    Rep. John Culberson, R-Texas, who supports the bill, said there was indeed anger and that conservatives in Congress seemed to be more in touch with it than was the White House.

    ``Our constituents are berserk with fury over the unprotected borders,'' he said. ``The borders have been entirely unprotected for far too long.''

    Of fellow Republicans, Culberson said, ``We've got a tiny little handful that want to pass guest-worker legislation.''

    ``But until we get the borders under control,'' he said, ``we'll never win the war on terror and it's pointless to discuss the guest-worker program.''

    Erin Healy, a White House press officer, said the House bill included security measures that were ``a vital component to immigration reform.'' But she said the White House would push for broader immigration legislation.

    ``The Senate has already indicated that they plan to take action in the beginning of next year on immigration legislation,'' Healy said. ``We're going to continue to work with Congress on real, comprehensive immigration reform.''

  • #2
    Dear all, is this for real?

    Crackdown on immigration

    HOUSE BILL WOULD NOW BE A FEDERAL CRIME


    WASHINGTON - The Republican-controlled House is poised to pass one of the toughest border security measures in more than a decade, cracking down on illegal immigrants and their employers and defying President Bush's call for a comprehensive bill that would grant millions of illegal immigrants already in the United States a right to work here temporarily.

    The measure, expected to clear the House this week, would for the first time make it a federal crime to live in the United States illegally. That provision would turn millions of immigrants into felons, ineligible to win any legal status. Currently, living in the United States without a document such as a visa or a green card is a violation of civil immigration law, not criminal law.

    Immigrant-rights groups have vowed to fight the measures.

    ``We are doing everything in our power to let people know that this is a huge mistake,'' said Marshall Fitz, director of advocacy for the American Immigration Lawyers Association. ``This is an extraordinary change in the way we have treated people in this country.''

    The bill also would broaden the immigrant-smuggling statute to embrace those who shield or offer support to illegal immigrants. Offenders, including employees of social-service agencies and church groups, could face up to five years in prison.

    The legislation would require the mandatory detention, until removal from the country, of non-Mexican immigrants who are entering the United States illegally; would increase financing for sheriffs in border states to allow them to detain illegal immigrants; and would toughen penalties for employers who hire them.

    The proposal, which would require the Department of Homeland Security to expand greatly a fledgling system intended to verify the immigration status of all the nation's employees, has been hailed by many conservatives in Congress as vital to combating illegal immigration and tightening the border with Mexico.

    The bill was approved by the House Judiciary Committee last Thursday. The committee chair, Rep. James Sensenbrenner Jr., R-Wis., said it would ``help restore the integrity of our nation's borders and re-establish respect for our laws by holding violators accountable, including human traffickers, employers who hire illegal aliens and alien gang members who terrorize communities.''

    Critics say it is mean-spirited and makes compassion a crime.

    Cecilia Muñoz, vice president for policy at the National Council of La Raza, a Latino civil rights group, said the bill broadens the definition of smuggling and harboring so much that a church group that finds someone dying of dehydration in the desert and takes him to the hospital could be potentially subject to criminal penalties.

    Most analysts predicting that the leadership's measure will pass in the House on Thursday.

    Meanwhile, some other House Republicans say the Sensenbrenner bill doesn't go far enough to stem the flow of illegal immigrants.

    Rep. Duncan Hunter, R-El Cajon, chair of the House Armed Services Committee, is planning to offer an amendment to build fences at strategic locations along the U.S.-Mexico border.

    Other lawmakers said they would try to offer other amendments, including one that would end birthright citizenship for children of illegal immigrants.

    Many Democrats, including California Rep. Howard Berman of Van Nuys, say conservatives are supporting the House bill solely to gain political points, not out of any belief that it will become law.

    ``There's a lot of anger out there,'' Berman said, ``so rather than solving the problem, they're playing to the cheap seats.''

    Rep. John Culberson, R-Texas, who supports the bill, said there was indeed anger and that conservatives in Congress seemed to be more in touch with it than was the White House.

    ``Our constituents are berserk with fury over the unprotected borders,'' he said. ``The borders have been entirely unprotected for far too long.''

    Of fellow Republicans, Culberson said, ``We've got a tiny little handful that want to pass guest-worker legislation.''

    ``But until we get the borders under control,'' he said, ``we'll never win the war on terror and it's pointless to discuss the guest-worker program.''

    Erin Healy, a White House press officer, said the House bill included security measures that were ``a vital component to immigration reform.'' But she said the White House would push for broader immigration legislation.

    ``The Senate has already indicated that they plan to take action in the beginning of next year on immigration legislation,'' Healy said. ``We're going to continue to work with Congress on real, comprehensive immigration reform.''

    Comment


    • #3
      Dear Andras,

      Where did you get this? I have seen other articles that mention the debate online recently. The information I read about is called Border Protection, Antiterrorism and Illegal Immigration Control Act of 2005, H.R. 4437. My understanding of this, which could be way off is that the proposal is being considered and has not been voted on yet. Who knows how it will turn out.

      The large number of illegal immigrants has been in the news (CNN Lou Dobbs)a lot lately.
      I don't doubt that 99.9 % of immigrants come here in search of a better life, but if that person is only supposed to stay for a year, then he or she should leave in a year. And just like any house guest should know, if you're not invited you don't come and every guest must eventually leave. There are many ways to come to the USA legally, granted doing so takes time, but aren't good things worth the wait?
      It's simple, do what you are supposed to do and the world would be a much better place for all of us. If immigrants, US employers, USCIS and law enforcement officials followed the rules the way they were written, we wouldn't have 10, 11 or 12 million illegal immigrants living her now.

      Comment


      • #4
        I have never heard this.

        Republicans have historically been pro immigrant and compassionate. Democrats have been anti immigrant from the very beginning and the origin of the Democratic party was rooted in anti immigrant sentiment. Democrats have been the ones to use immigrants as Cannon Fodder during the Civil War on both sides and have espoused violence against them during economically challenging times. Today, Bush, McCain and the Republican Party are trying very hard to pass a bill to legalize millions of people here illegally but the Democrats are refusing to cooperate.

        Democrats of course try to pretend that they are the compassionate party, but the blood of millions of immigrants is on their hands.

        Such a bill would most likely be held unconstitutional as lacking due process requirements of the U.S. Constitution and as a status crime, it would be void. Furthermore, it would require the Federal Government to have police powers which is also unconstitutional. While the federal government has the power to create immigration policy, it does not have the power to police people once they are here nor is the government allowed to make local police enforce the will of the federal government.

        Comment


        • #5
          i got this from google news just this morning.

          all you need to do is go to the Google News and do a google "sensenbrenner" and "federal crime" and you'll find tons of articles on this topic.

          here are three articles as examples:

          http://www.azstarnet.com/news/106886

          http://www.news8austin.com/content/h...151791&SecID=2

          http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...migration.html

          Comment


          • #6
            thank you Andras, I'll go look now

            Comment


            • #7
              http://discuss.ilw.com/eve/forums/a/...1010595521/p/5

              ImmortalE
              Posted July 10, 2005 02:58 PM

              But.. To be absolutely honest..
              If my judgement doesn't fail me, if all the past and pressent patterns are to be relied upon, I would suggest that before inevitable liberalization of immigration takes place, there will be an extreme intolerance and targeted enforcement of immigration law against 'undocumenteds'.
              I repeatedly said this in past.

              It's what I would call a "wave thing".

              No argument or logic at present can persuade people like Rep. Tancredo that it is not in the interest of Public of America to do as he wishes.
              Only after millions and may be billions of dollars wasted, hundreds of thousand of immigrant families separated and detroyed, single parents and parentless US Citizen children left behind, businesses lost, hardships caused..
              only THEN there will be a loud public outcry and demand that the remaining aliens be given a chance to become a LEGAL part of this Society.


              This is what I project, based on my knowledge and analysis of past.
              As history shows, people 'en mass' never act reasonably, but always obey the physical laws of momentary nesessity..

              Comment


              • #8
                andras, many thanks for the late breaking news. i just read a few of the articles on google. why can't the republicans be more compassionate? we broke the law by overstaying our visas but now we're just trying to survive by getting legalized. we'll be more than happy to pay a fine if we break the law but please be more compassionate because we've become part of the american social fabric.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Christain;

                  Republicans are INFINETLY more compassionate than Democrats. Our is a nation of laws, not of men. That is one thing you savages can't seem to comprehend. Republicans support freedom all over the world as we see in Iraq. If you break a law, do not complain of the conseuences. However, as I stated, only the Republican party is trying to pass a law to legalize you people. There may be some Republicans opposed to this, but that is the minority view. To the Democrats you are only cannon fodder. Grints were used as literal cannon fodder in the Civil War. Now you are being used as fodder in a campaign to distort the truth.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Michael,

                    What you're saying is contrary to the bills that Tancredo and Sensenbrenner are trying to get passed. My driver's license will be taken away in the not too distant future through the REAL ID act. I won't be able to drive to work anymore once the Registry of Motor Vehicles start implementing the law. Now we'll be federal criminals if this bill gets passed. The Democrats are trying to legalize us by introducing bills that would allow us a chance to be legal again. Before Democrat Senator Dascheles lost the election, he introduced a bill that would allow all of us longtime illegal aliens to be legal again. Now Democrat Senator Kennedy is carrying the torch.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I just gone done reading this new news in the New York Times. Thanks for posting, Andras.

                      My wife and I are "illegal aliens" in the US. We came using tourist visas but we've never left. We stayed illegally and opened an Indian restaurant. We now have 4 children, all of them under the age of 8, but all born in the US. We have been living here for so many years now and we own a nice home. Our kids are so Americanized and speak English without an Indian accent.

                      My beloved brother passed away in September and I couldn't go back to India to attend his funeral. My parents are very old now and I haven't seen them and my brothers and sisters and their families for so long. We're so sad because we might never see our parents again.

                      Bills like this one make us want to cry. We broke the law but shame on us. Please don't penalize us any further. We desperately want to be legal again.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        An article from the Hundustan Times.


                        http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/1...0,00050001.htm

                        1.4 million immigration population in US from India

                        Press Trust of India

                        Washington, December 13, 2005

                        As the US Congress considers some tough immigration proposals to tighten the entry process into the country, a new study shows that of the 35.2 million foreign-born population in America in 2005, around 1.4 million are Indians.

                        There are 35.2 million foreign-born people with the number of illegal immigrants anywhere between 9 to 13 million, according to the study by the Centre for Immigration Studies.

                        "The 35.2 million immigrants living in the country in March 2005 is the highest number ever recorded -- two-and-a-half times the 13.5 million during the peak of the last great immigration wave in 1910," said by Steven Camarota, director of research for the Centre.

                        Of the 35.2 million foreign born immigrants in the United States in 2005, South Asia would account for 1.8 million with India taking the bulk of this figure with 1.411 millions and accounting for a citizenship rate of nearly 34 per cent.

                        About 12.1 per cent of the current US population was born in another country, the highest percentage since 1920, according to Census figures.

                        Overall Mexico will come away with the highest number of foreign immigrants at nearly 11 million which will be followed by East Asia, South Asia (India) and Vietnam in South East Asia.

                        Statistics show that as far as India is concerned, the period 2000 to 2005 showed a sharp upswing in the number of immigrants at nearly 460,000 for the 5-year period.

                        The pre-1980 statistics show an immigrant population number for India at 170,000, rising to 209,000 between 1980 and 1989 and to 573,000 between 1990 and 1999.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          You want to be legal or you just don't want to be deported for being here illegally? How have you been penalized? You have lived in this country for however long, your children were born here, they attend school here, you own a home and a business. None of these things sound as if you have been penalized for being in the country illegally.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            http://discuss.ilw.com/eve/forums/a/...1010595521/p/5

                            ImmortalE
                            Posted July 10, 2005 02:58 PM

                            But.. To be absolutely honest..
                            If my judgement doesn't fail me, if all the past and pressent patterns are to be relied upon, I would suggest that before inevitable liberalization of immigration takes place, there will be an extreme intolerance and targeted enforcement of immigration law against 'undocumenteds'.
                            I repeatedly said this in past.

                            It's what I would call a "wave thing".

                            No argument or logic at present can persuade people like Rep. Tancredo that it is not in the interest of Public of America to do as he wishes.
                            Only after millions and may be billions of dollars wasted, hundreds of thousand of immigrant families separated and detroyed, single parents and parentless US Citizen children left behind, businesses lost, hardships caused..
                            only THEN there will be a loud public outcry and demand that the remaining aliens be given a chance to become a LEGAL part of this Society.


                            This is what I project, based on my knowledge and analysis of past.
                            As history shows, people 'en mass' never act reasonably, but always obey the physical laws of momentary nesessity..

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              This legislation is going to work backwards.

                              No law should work backward!

                              If being illegal was not a crime 15 years ago it can not be penalized as a crime now, can it?


                              If smoking cigarettes was legal at work 15 years ago and it is not now you cannot be penalized for doing it 15 years ago, can you?

                              If drinking alcohol on the street was legal 15 years ago and not now you cannot be penalized for doing it 15 years ago, can you?

                              Apply the NEW laws to the NEW illegal aliens not to the people who came here so long time ago when it was not a crime.

                              Comment

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