being an illegal alien to be a federal crime?

[Byasha Struzhkin]

To those permanently pissed off individuals such as Michael, SunDevilUSA and the like:
What do you care if people stay in the US in search of the better life for themselves and for their children? Most people in this world spend the days of their lives in abominable poverty and are subjected to daily deprivation. Few manage to escape this lot my moving to the countries where life is at least bearable. Some manage to accomplish that through legal routes, others have to by-pass tough barriers and enter more prosperous countries any way they can. People are people and they are just looking for a chance to live their lives with dignity and a certain degree of prosperity.

Does that normal human desire to escape pain and suffering somehow hurt and offend you, Michael and the bunch? Why do you even care? You got nothing better to do with your life than spend endless hours in internet, bashing immigrants and sticking your nose into personal affairs of others that are really none of your business? Where does all that anger come from? Where you molested by a Mexican gardener when you were a child? Did A South American maid refuse your sexual advances when, pimpled-faced and awkward, you tried to make a "move" on her in your early *****? There has to be an explanation for all that anger in you and judging by its intensity it without a doubt has its roots in sexual frustration.

Come on man! Pull a stick out of you're a$$ and have more compassion for your fellow human beings!

And get laid, for God's sake! You are becoming unbearable! ))))

[Byasha Struzhkin]

Here is what Michael writes in a different discussion thread:

"All I care about is LOVE. American women are s k a n ks. I would take the sleaziest and hottest 18 year old mail order bride over any American woman."

Shoot!!! I was right on the money in my previous post!!! I knew that you are mad 'cause you are seriously "undersexed"!

[AliBA]

Byasha--How many more illegal aliens are we supposed to ignore, out of the literally billions of poor impoverished people in the world? How much more illegal-alien related expenses are taxpayers supposed to pay? And there are costs, every time I look at my tax bill with higher rates to pay for more schools for illegal alien children in my area, and every time impoverished immigrants picket my local hospital to get free medical care--even though my insurance rates rise regularly. Just yesterday, an immigrant woman was begging as I left a store in the suburbs. Is she one of those "hard working" immigrants we're supposed to welcome--people with neither the skills nor the education to support themselves?

We have gotten to this point because the people who were supposed to enforce the laws looked the other way, with the total endorsement of people and organizations who benefit from illegal immigration--no matter what it costs the rest of us. Continuing to look the other way means literally losing our country and our way of life, in much the way that Europeans are losing theirs.

[Byasha Struzhkin]

Well, AliBa, you reap what you sow! Globalization is a western idea that is being very actively promoted by the US. You want to police the world, sell the world your products and services, control the world's natural resources and yet somehow stay separated from that world by high fences and deep trenches... I doubt that is going to work.

[wooddell6]

I for one dont want people to just look the other way. I want people to see that there are many(not all) illegals that love this country. not just for the money, but because they have been here for a long time, have family and work hard. Something needs to change. I dont think that green cards should just be handed out to every illegal here. But i think that they should be given a chance to prove to the government and the US citizens that they deserve to be here and can contribute to the economy. Something should be passed that would conform to both sides of the arguement. As far as losing our way of life, I dont think that the illegals are causing that. American people are becoming to laid back and lazy (not all). Our way of life is changing because many poor are finding it easier and more convienient to sit at home and collect welfare checks. The illegal aliens cannot be blamed for all the ills in this Country. Deporting all illegals will not change the way Americans think about work. Welfare collectors will not jump out of thier lazy boys to go fill the jobs once taken by the illegals that were deported. American companies will just move to a cheaper Country. The "made in America" labels on our products will be a thing of the past.

[Byasha Struzhkin]

The "made in America" labels on our products will be a thing of the past.

Man, check your nearest store. "made in America" label is already impossible to find. It is all made in China these days. America has long become a service-oriented economy.
Nothing wrong with that though. You would have paid a lot more for all your gadgets and toys had they been produced in the states, since no american would agree to work for a bowl of rice.

[AliBA]

Again, Wooddell, I don't believe that illegal aliens "cause" all the ills in this country, but they sure aggravate the ones that are here. In my area, we have a lot of increased gang activity, largely because of MS-13. Housing is also expensive, and overcrowding in immigrant households, especially with illegal renting, is common and dangerous. Then, there's the little matter of wages--the more illegal alien labor there is, the harder it is to get wages up in some jobs, and around here it's simply too expensive if you don't earn at least $35 an hour. There's talk of building "affordable housing" for middle class homeowners (teachers, police, etc.) who earn $50,000-$100,000, and for low-income workers. The latter would include immigrant and possibly illegal alien families. Also, there's been discussion of expanding bus service way out into the 'burbs to again accommodate low-income workers who need it to get to jobs. In other words, that cheap labor becomes very expensive very quickly and the costs are borne largely by the middle class, not the upper, and it's the latter who benefit most from their services.

[AliBA]

Byasha--Globalization is not a "Western" idea, but a new version of a very old one. I seem to recall various empires from the Middle East and Asia, as well as the Holy Roman, which tried to spread their language, culture, and influence. The only thing that's new is that until recently at least, the US hasn't sought to deliberately expand its reach. My Turkish students spoke of "cultural imperialism", but they were the ones rushing to buy Western fashion and they and their parents were the ones who wanted to attend an English-language university, no doubt in hope that it would give them an edge in business or make them seem "cool".

Many of the companies that were precursors to modern globalization weren't American at all. Even today, when you speak of "American" companies, well, these companies are "American" in name only, if that. Their first and only loyalty is the company. What was forecast in the 1970s with the book Global Reach is really evident these days.

As for people trying to get here, I can understand why they try, but they had better understand why we will limit who we accept, and make it uncomfortable if they get here illegally. After all, we have many historical precedents to warn us.

[AliBA]

There's plenty wrong with being only a service economy. For one thing, the jobs that are replacing manufacturing don't pay as well, which cuts off a major route to the middle class that African-Americans and immigrants were able to use to get ahead. Many services are also readily outsourced overseas more easily than manufacturing plants were, which is added pressure on wages and benefits. Consider, too, that if we have continued high levels of immigration, both legal and illegal, there is little chance of being able to pressure employers into raising wages. They can always go out and get another "guest worker" for minimum wage.

Also, innovation suffers if all one does is market or sell products, not develop and build them. From a national security standpoint, is it really healthy to have to import aircraft, telecommunications equipment, steel, etc.?

[Byasha Struzhkin]

Byasha--Globalization is not a "Western" idea, but a new version of a very old one. I seem to recall various empires from the Middle East and Asia, as well as the Holy Roman, which tried to spread their language, culture, and influence. The only thing that's new is that until recently at least, the US hasn't sought to deliberately expand its reach

Well, in that case you probably also recall what happened to all those great empires of the past: all of them simply disintegrated into oblivion. Italy is all what's left of formerly formidable Roman Empire and Turkey is nothing but a shadow of the Otoman Empire that once streched half the way across the world. The same goes for the Soviet Union. The US is the last modern day empire standing. The question is: for how long? Time will tell.

[AliBA]

You might also want to check out recent research that shows that it isn't those who are particularly poor who immigrate to the U.S. illegally. It seems that most Mexicans who come illegally actually left jobs in Mexico. Seems the theory is that illegal immigration actually increases as development increases (at least to a point). People then have more money to pay smugglers, etc. Guess they just want more. And of course, those who can get visas and overstay are probably pretty well off by the standards of their own countries, if they have enough to convince our consulate they'll return home.

[wooddell6]

Aliba, I cannot dissagree with what you are saying. I understand that Illegals contribute to alot the ills. All I am saying is that deporting all the illegals will not solve the problems in the US. My brother is a narcotics detective in Miami (former Marine). He deals with illegals all the time. His biggest concern is the Cubans. The government makes it easy for them to become legal as soon as they touch US soil, yet they make it impossible for other illegals to become legal. It is a broken system. Living in Miami is very expensive for middle class people. There is a major problem with poverty and illegal activity there. Our system needs fixed and i dont think that deporting all illegals is the answer.

[AliBA]

I do remember, Byasha, which is precisely why the U.S. had better be careful about who and how many it admits. We all know about the barbarous hordes that brought down Rome. The Ottoman Empire perhaps overreached in forming alliances with the "wrong side" in WWI. Ataturk rescued Turkey from oblivion by strongly emphasizing TURKISH identity, but this puts it at odds with groups such as Kurds who want to maintain their own identities and even, possibly, their own states. From what I've heard, the old USSR has largely broken into states along ethnic and racial lines. All of these are good examples of the dangers of multiculturalism.

[Byasha Struzhkin]

There's plenty wrong with being only a service economy. For one thing, the jobs that are replacing manufacturing don't pay as well, which cuts off a major route to the middle class that African-Americans and immigrants were able to use to get ahead. Many services are also readily outsourced overseas more easily than manufacturing plants were, which is added pressure on wages and benefits. Consider, too, that if we have continued high levels of immigration, both legal and illegal, there is little chance of being able to pressure employers into raising wages. They can always go out and get another "guest worker" for minimum wage.

It seems to me that you are putting the blame in all the wrong places or upon the wrong peple, to be exact. That is just capitalism, my friend, and unlike Europe, America practices it without regard for social justice and equality. The almighty dollar rules! I understand your concerns - there are indeed very valid reasons to be worried. But it is the corporate greed that causes those wrongs and not the poor immigrants who just try to get by, who are exploited and are being taken advantage of.

[Publicus]

Byasha Struzhkin, let me give you a good advice. Stop arguing with people on this forum. You are just wasting your time. They have no power.

What you need to do is get to work. Talk to your Citizen friends, and neighbors and get them to write to the Senate to oppose this bill or some of its harsh provisions. This is not a fair bill and mostly unpractical. Get to work, write letters, make phone calls and donate money to the AILA and other pro-immigration groups. Stop wasting your time. You seem to have a lot of energy, so use it wisely.