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Illegal Immigration 101: result of economic need

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  • #16
    Illegal immigration is economic and social terrorism, and should be dealt with accordingly. I have no problem with immigrants coming to this country legally. But when or government is talking about giving 11 million illegals amnesty, it makes me want to give up the 18+ years I have been serving and defending this country. It basically says Mexico and Vicente Fox are running our immigration programs. It's also sad when my fiancee applied for a visitor visa to come here for 2 weeks was denied because she was filipina. The U.S. Embassay in Tokyo basically told her she was going to abandon her daughter in Japan, and go live with her mother and sister who are U.S. citizens, and went by the law to come to the states. It seems funny to me that they required not only the application, but employment records, bank statements, and proof of residence plus $100.00 (non-refundable) to apply for a visa and all they do is look at her passport and application. Seems to me like our embassay is just in it for the money to provide more benefits to illegal mexicans.

    If the illegals want a green card, they need to go back to where they came from and apply just like everyone else, period.
    Do you really know how long it takes to get a green card, or are you really that ignorant about the subject.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." John Adams on Defense of the boston Massacre

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    • #17
      And why does it take so long to get a green card now? It didn't take long at all in the early 1990s.

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      • #18
        Your "economic" theory just does not hold water when I look at consumer preferences about products, labor, and fair working conditions.
        It is not "MY" economic theory, but price elasticity of demand. Go back and review your economics texts. As for people preferring more expensive products, go check the literature on the backbending demand curve.

        If you know anything at all about monopolistic competition, then you know that the preferred way to compete is not based on price, but on convincing the consumer that YOUR product or service fulfills their needs best--and providing the product that does that best. That's what the entire discipline of marketing is about. In other words, to build a "mini-monopoly". Even industries which typically operate under pure competition such as agriculture are trying to build brand identities and loyalty to allow them to charge higher prices to consumers. Hence, the value added to agricultural products: packaged lettuce, boneless chicken, and the like. Campbell's fresh mushrooms. Dole brand fresh pineapple and bananas. To try to continually compete on price with competitors is to drive profits for all into the ground. What a company seeks to do is create the best VALUE for the money, which is not necessarily the cheapest price.

        As for labor unions, membership in labor unions now comprises less than 12 percent of the workforce. So, find another scapegoat.

        Slavery was expensive to get into--it took money to buy slaves--but it gave owners "property rights". Slaves were in effect investments which could be sold off for a profit, or hired out to work for someone else at a good profit to their owner. They also reproduced themselves. Sure beats paying wages, now doesn't it?! (If it weren't profitable, do you really think it would have persisted so long, or been fought for so hard?)

        As for "lack of commitment", shall we speak of employers' lack of commitment to employees?! Companies want temporary or contract labor that they can pay rock bottom wages to, no benefits, and dispense with at a moment's notice. My brother, an engineer who worked for a major company for almost 20 years, was let go by email. He came in one day, and had an email from his boss telling him not to come in the next Monday. Would you want that kind of treatment from your boss? They show no respect and no loyalty to employees, yet expect it?! Get real. And, should those "hard working" illegal aliens get legalized, and ask for more money, what do you think the response will be? I'd be surprised if they don't get canned, and replaced with cheaper illegal aliens or "guest workers".

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        • #19
          Illegal immigrants are just that "illegal"!
          They are criminals and anyone employing them are too. The bottom line is secure our borders.

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          • #20
            Posted April 12, 2006 07:35 AM
            And why does it take so long to get a green card now? It didn't take long at all in the early 1990s.
            It has to do with the 1997 Immigration and Reform Act and the 2001 patriot act. Both required more paperwork and authentication to go through the process. Prior to the laws, the paperwork was fairly simple and not very complex. Now it is every complex and requires an attorney to handle even the simpliest of matters if you are not well versed in immigration law. Hence the problem and why we have illegal immigration. Even in the 1980's, it was very simple to get a visa to stay longer than the 30 day visa waiver. Now it is very difficult to get a visa unless it is based on a bonafide business or employement reason.
            "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." John Adams on Defense of the boston Massacre

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            • #21
              You forget, Hudson. A big reason for the longer time frame is simply that there are now many more applicants, due to previous amnesties and "guest worker" programs such as H1-B. and many of those exceptions you're talking about were created by Congress's attempts to "mend" immigration policy to suit special interests.

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              • #22
                Aliba,
                You clearly have a socialist ideology. You mix your slanted economics knowledge with political rethoric of government protectionism. The difference between your arguments and mine is that you base your opinions on what you've read in textbooks or political propaganda while I base my opinions on real-life experiences that I deal with in a business environment. Obviously, you have never faced situations where your decisions affect other people's lives and where the objective is survival so that employees can feed their families. So let me summarize my initial dialogue of this posting: Illegals are a result of an economic need for affordable labor costs to keep business profitable in several industries. If the majority of low-income Americans had the work ethic,appreciation and stability of these illegals, then businesses would re-consider their hiring practices. So stop bull'shting yourself with non-sense and encourage your brother to stop whinning and be more productive in his next job so that he doesn't make the 'undesirable' list and get unpleasant e-mails in the future..

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                • #23
                  this is such tiresome hor$e$hit we keep hearing from whining illegal alien supporters....supposedly, according to this intellectually-challenged group, illegals have a stronger work ethic than American citizens....odd that illegals' "law abiding ethics" don't seem to reach the same height.
                  News flash to moronic illegal alien supporters: Americans were here first, working far harder to make this country what it is, long before law-breaking illegals snuck in to leech off of hard working AMerican taxpayers.
                  You are just another unpatriotic jagoff - maybe you should consider moving to Mexico and turning that country around with all of your 'unique' ideas....why not give Vicente a call and see if he wants to hire you?

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                  • #24
                    Matrix--It may surprise you, but this country is MORE than an economic system. It is a democratic republic, which means that it is the people of this country who decide what the rules are, NOT CORPORATIONS. In fact, it is law and order, laws created by this Republic, that enable capitalism to function and businesses to feel secure. If you don't believe, try looking at corrupt societies where companies are required to pay bribes even to operate, and can't be sure if the government will even be there the next day. That, sir, is REAL life.

                    If the majority of Americans were as gullible as these illegal aliens, we would never have achieved what we have today. My grandparents worked in factories that practiced what you believe in, worked 6 days a week for long hours and little pay. It was when workers unionized and got rights that this society took off economically. If these illegal aliens are the paragons of virtue that you claim, then just why is it that their own societies don't value or need their labor? And isn't it funny that those illegal aliens you so extoll are the ones that are hot for organizing these days. What is SEIU but illegal aliens? And that illegal aliens are likely to be the salvation of the Union movement which was becoming obsolete as Americans got better off and feeling secure. These new workers know they're being played for fools by guys like you AND have the freedom and ability under our laws, the laws my grandparents WON through their efforts, to organize. If you can't understand that, then please move yourself and your business to countries that practice what you seem to believe, such as Mexico. But isn't that precisely what illegal aliens are fleeing?

                    As for my brother, well, sir, if you weren't so stupid, you'd quit whining about needing cheap illegal labor, and get creative about your business in ways that don't rely on it. But I guess you need government subsidies such as this to keep your feeble business afloat because you can't compete without it. Some business person you are--not. My brother may not have a "right" to a job, but businesses don't have the "right" to stay in business, either.

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                    • #25
                      Matrix--Do you even have any idea of the kind of workers you want imported, other than that they'll work hard for little money? Marxists? You who apparently has a problem with Socialism? Take a look at the following, about the planned May 1 boycott:


                      WIAN: A group of Los Angeles truck drivers seeking union representation and a 25 percent pay raise is now joining what's being billed as the Great American Boycott of May 1st. It seeks to cripple the U.S. economy by advocating no work, no school, no selling and no buying.

                      Some May Day boycott organizers are not only calling on businesses to shut down, but also asking California school districts to declare Monday, May 1st, a school holiday.

                      NATIVO LOPEZ, MEXICAN-AMERICAN POLITICAL ASSN.: I would like them to join us on May 1st in shutting down their business and for school authorities to recognize May 1st as a floating holiday. I'm asking them to get in front, anticipate the great absence in their workforce and in the schools.

                      A state Education Department officials say the decision is up to individual school districts, but she hopes the kids stay in school.

                      Boycott leaders vow they will "... settle for nothing less than full amnesty and dignity for the millions of undocumented workers presently in the U.S." The May 1st boycott has clear Marxist overtones. Supporters include communists, socialist and anarchist groups.

                      Traditional immigrant and Latino rights organizations and unions are also involved, as are some politicians. Listen to the reasoning of California's state senate majority leader.

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