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ILLEGAL ALIENS ARE CRIMINALS

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  • #61
    Haha! Moving target? Stop dodging please. Show me your best offense. You seemed so brave on the first two pages of your clowny thread.

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    • #62
      LOL...if you or someone comes up with a real question or comment about the topic Illegal Aliens are Criminals...and the answer isn't already in this thread...let me know...LOL

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      • #63
        Okay, just please show me the Page Number, Date, and Time. And I mean "definitive answers." Not too far to go back to. We're just on the fourth page.

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        • #64
          Ok, you go find a nice tree to hug, or take your meds...I have dinner plans.

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          • #65
            Hahaha! I'll be waiting... still "in heat."

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            • #66
              Como on b i t c h e s, stop arguing relax, have a life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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              • #67
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                We're still debating if an illegal is an illegal? RN is in heat over this? Strange libido.

                If they weren't doing anything wrong the immigration jails would be converted to hotels. We wouldn't have immigration judges. We wouldn't have people charged with illegal presence or entry. We wouldn't need green cards, visas, or passports for that matter. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                Davdah, the debate is about whether an illegal is a automatically a criminal, as Jeff claims. I honestly didn't think anyone was labeled a criminal in the US until they were found to be so during due process. Innocent until proven guilty? Or did I miss something along the way?

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                • #68
                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                  A note to whknapp. Years ago they may have released illegals within hours, not any more. That was called OR. Or on own recognizance. Just like they do for any number of crimes. Now, its a different story. In San Diego numerous illegals are captured daily and housed in the several jails and detention centers we have here. None are released until they see the judge. Most are mexican and as you know we are very close to the border here.

                  Tell anyone sitting in one of those 'detention centers' its not a jail. What is the difference? There are guards, steel doors, you wear a numbered jumpsuit, and your freedom is taken away. Seems like the same boat to me. The food is supposed to be better than a regular jail. If that is of any consequence. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


                  I know that illegal entrants from Mexico, when caught, are returned the same day to Mexico (voluntary return). OTM's are not routinely released anymore due to their high rate (almost 100%) of failure to appear to the immigration court hearing.

                  Does that mean Mexican illegal entrants are not criminals, while the rest (OTM) are?

                  Legal entrants that overstay their visas are not criminals then, but merely civil offenders?

                  OTM's that are realeased and fail to appear to a scheduled court appointment are criminals of just civil offenders?

                  Mexican illegal entrants who refuse to depart voluntarily and are forcely removed are criminals or just civil offenders?

                  This is getting more and more confusing

                  I think that's why Jeff and the like have a tendency to lump all undocumented immigrants as criminals. It's the easiest thing to do, and you don't have to think...

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                  • #69
                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jeff:
                    LOL...if you or someone comes up with a real question or comment about the topic Illegal Aliens are Criminals...and the answer isn't already in this thread...let me know...LOL </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                    Jeff,

                    Question:

                    Are you Senator Jeff Sessions from Alabama?

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                      We're still debating if an illegal is an illegal? RN is in heat over this? Strange libido.

                      If they weren't doing anything wrong the immigration jails would be converted to hotels. We wouldn't have immigration judges. We wouldn't have people charged with illegal presence or entry. We wouldn't need green cards, visas, or passports for that matter. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      EL, let me put it this way.

                      Illegal equals illegal. This is not the problem, of course. Please look at the thread's title.

                      Illegal Aliens Are Criminals. That's the point of contention.

                      The phrase "Lady in heat" has been used figuratively, as a metaphor specifically, for added effect. Libido? Whoops! I don't intend to expect too much for sure.

                      The rest of his post is of course just being consistent. Zero point zero net value.

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                      • #71
                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Babybeh:
                        Como on b i t c h e s, stop arguing relax, have a life!!!!!!!!!!!!!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                        This is one thing worse, at negative point negative net value.

                        When you said "have a life," you didn't mean a life like yours, did you? Haha! No, thanks!

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                          Proud USC, there is one catch to due process and such. You have be a citizen in order to enjoy those rights. In immigrantion court the Gov is under no obligation to provide an attorney if you can't afford one. For a USC they are in any criminal proceeding. That is where some of the confusion rests. Not a citizen, different set of rules.

                          I don't know about the Mexicans being sent back the same day whknapp. Not always. If it were just a civil issue it would be like small claims court with judge Judy. Hmm, Not a bad idea for a show. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
                          No Davdah, under due process of law, all "persons" subject to the laws of this land are entitled to due process of law. Persons, through various SCOTUS (Supreme Court of the United States) rulings define persons as citizens, U.S nationals, permanent residents, immigrants, and illegal immigrants on US soil. this link will help you understand what due process is.

                          Illegal immigrants are defined as immigrants under INA 212 for this purpose. It does not mean they are entitled to the green card, but are defined as US persons within the scope of the 14 amendment.
                          "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." John Adams on Defense of the boston Massacre

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                          • #73
                            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jeff:
                            RN: I can keep repeating the law to you over and over, gave examples, references...you may actually be completely unable to understand. What is perfectly clear, and in written form, makes sense to someone like me, but people like you on the other hand, you need alot more explanation. No wonder there are sooo many illegal aliens here. You illegal aliens and supporters are just not capable of understanding laws and facts or you just refuse to abide by them...but illegal aliens will continue to be rounded up, and deported. Also, just because you are not directly notified every time an illegal alien is caught / deported, does not mean it isn't happening. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
                            You are not repeating the law, Jeff, but you are giving your interpretation of what the law should read. Again, not all illegal aliens are criminals. Yes, they do violate the law, but the law that they violate is civil , not criminal offense. Violating a civil offense, which is most of the federal and state statues does not make a crime. Wiknopp and RN have correctly pointed out the differences in the law while you provided no evidence whatsoever. You have not even provided a Supreme Court ruling, nor a BIA ruling, nor anyone else. And yes, even an immigration judge will tell you that not all illegal immigrants are criminals. And what you are repeating comes from Heather MacDonald and others in VDARE, American Patrol, and other anti-immigration sites, both legal and illegal.
                            "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." John Adams on Defense of the boston Massacre

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                              Generically speaking the rules are different. We can't flog them but the entitlements aren't there either. For one, no attorney will be provided at Gov cost. How much chance does a person have without one in the court room, about zero to nada.

                              Perhaps in a technical way its not criminal but the treatment is the same. You get arrested, go to jail, have a trial. Your convicted and a punishment is handed down. Aside a paper difference the end result is the same. You still get screwed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                              First, you don't get arrested, YOU ARE PLACED UNDER ADMINISTRATIVE CUSTODY. There's a big difference. Second, you don't go to jail; for practical reasons, YOU ARE TAKEN TO A DETENTION CENTER (unless you're a CRIMINAL). Third, you don't have a trial; if you choose not to DEPART VOLUNTARILY, you see an immigration judge, who is a DECISION MAKER. Fourth, you cannot be convicted by an immigration judge, nor given any punishment. S(he) only DECIDES the validity of your claim for relief of deportation or other immigration benefit(s), according to the evidence and based on the correspondig law(s).



                              "... The immigration judges thus are critical decision makers in what is a complex mix of international treaties and U.S. law..."

                              http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/reports/160/

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                                Not arrested? Really?, no need for bonding or things like that? Hmm, well, I'll get the form number so you can see for yourself. I guess I need to ask them why they asked me for 10k for what turned out to be a bogus paperwork error. It says 'ARRESTED' The detention center looks like a jail to me. I have seen the inside of one and it has all the trappings of a prison, jail or what ever you want to call it. You usually get taken there in handcuffs too. The judge's decision does have far reaching consequnces. They are called immigration judges. There are lawyers. It is in a court room. There is even a balif. Lastly its called immigration court. Yup, I think it is a court of sorts. An unfavorable ruling will result in a person's inability to ever set foot on US soil ever again. That sounds like a punishment to me. You can change the name to sugar coat it but it is what it is. This one has its feathers, webbed feet, and it quackes. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
                                Davdah,
                                Aliens, even USC, can get bonded when one applies for a "sailing permit." The USC is bonded only if the USC income is included in the immigrant or nonimmigrant's income for filing the sailing permit, either form 2063 or form 1040-C. When ICE or CBP detains aliens because of an administrative procedure, the miranda rights are not read. Otherwse, they would be violating the due process clause.

                                Additionally, I am also "bonded" for certain legal procedings as well as some of my family members. Common examples which a person is bonded can include certain insurance agents, enrolled agents, private detectives, bounty hunters, a a few others.
                                "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." John Adams on Defense of the boston Massacre

                                Comment

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