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McCain Says Senate Immigration Bill Does Not Amount to Amnesty

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  • #46
    You certainly aren't a brilliant strategist, or even a decent thinker, Aliba (as apparent from numerous outrightly inconsistent and fallacious statements you made and that I exposed before).

    But some of the smartest and closest to Republican higher leadership think-tanks are little worried with what Tancredo does and have already warned of likely long-term consequences of following too-rigid-anti-immigrant path.


    • #47
      I never claimed to be a brilliant thinker, but then, I at least think. YOU mainly post other people's thoughts.

      I'm wondering how "brilliant" Republican strategists are these days. They've had some notable failures: the War, Harriet Miers, Dubai Ports... They're so brilliant that the President's standing in the polls is about as low as it's ever been, especially for a wartime president.


      • #48
        The very minute any bill starts to criminalize citizens and their freedom to marry anyone they want, that's when legislators will pay for endorsing draconian statutes. Aliens are seen as a separate group of society, a 'problem' not affecting most people in everyday life or as a political issue. But when criminal penalties are imposed on citizens, then all bets are off, and Congress knows this. The one thing a citizen is not going to tolerate is intrusion on personal matters. The guest worker program is irrelevant when compared to the individual freedom of U.S. citizens.


        • #49
          Dont be to certain that the house will reject any attempt to go on a house-senate hearing..Matter fact, im hearing words that rep. boehner, leader of the house republicans, stated that he's willing to make some compromises....It is also known that boehner does not share tancredo's view on immigration and voted against the house bill, which is great news.

          Remember, boehner is the top republican in the house, and he has the power to turn things around in a minute...The mistake that i see a lot of people like immortale, aliba, and others make is, they tend to believe that tancredo is the majority leader in the house,you need to realized that a lot of republican dispise tancredo ideology on immigration and member on his own party nicknamed him, crazy tancredo.

          I believe that they will be a house-senate hearing, and if there is one, then the house will adopt to a guest worker, otherwise, why would they go to a house-senate hearing if the house is 100% against what is being passed by the senate?

          Also, i will post a recent quote from house republican leade boehner which suggest he's open to negotiation, which mean, he's open to a guest worker program...Boehner has strong ties to big company busnesses and im sure they are talking to him to make sure that enought republican defect from the tancredo's ideology and i strongly believe that boehner will be able to make those vote defect tancredo's base.


          • #50
            Remember 1996? Tough immigration reform was passed in a year most refer to as "mean '96", only to be followed by the LIFE Act. What this means if that perhaps the guest worker program is not going to be considered now, but could very well become a more extensive "catch all" amnesty in the years to come. Others have made reference to this fact as well. Personally, I would prefer a limited guest worker program now than some form of "swift" amnesty in a couple years.


            • #51
              If they really want to avoid the term amnesty, applying the guest worker program now but requiring applicants to exit the country first to be processed and readmitted/rescreened will do just that. Personally, I think that'll be the concession to pass dubya's precious brain child.
              Besides, with the current projected cut-off date of 12/31/2003, plenty of people will remain illegal. Then what? another amnesty in 10-20yrs?


              • #52
                Personally, I could live with Cornyn-Kyl, as long as guest workers applied outside the country. HOWEVER, ANY GUEST WORKER PROGRAM REQUIRES STRONG ENFORCEMENT TO BE IN PLACE OR IT WILL NOT WORK. We will end up with the same situation that we have with our H-2 programs--business will not use it because they can get illegals cheaper and for less bother. We will end up with workers who violate the terms of the program and become illegals--again. Furthermore, any guest worker program should make employers bear the responsibility for health care and paying a decent wage, enough to keep workers above the poverty level. Of course, that may mean employers won't want a t guest worker program. Finally, this program has the same problem any other would have--the government hasn't the mechanisms in place to handle it.


                • #53
                  Yes, I've read Boehner's comments. It sounds like a trial balloon to me, to see what kind of reaction it gets.

                  No one ever said the House was 100 percent against a guest worker program. It doesn't have to be. For this, it just has to be 51 percent against. There are almost 500 members in the House, and the House is typically more responsive to the people's interests, while the Senate aligns more with business, just as it's been doing. The article I read also pointed out that Boehner's got ties to the businesses that are lobbying the Senate. That may not be a good thing for him--ordinary Americans are pretty disgusted with corruption and cronyism (Jack Abramoff just got 6 years).


                  • #54
                    I would give weight to the arguments of some employers who state that they don't want to lose experienced workers. However, those who don't qualify as very vital employees (and only very few would) should be required to leave and apply through the consulate, if for no other reason than to alleviate the workload of USCIS.


                    • #55
                      Guest worker programs a focal point of immigration arguments

                      CAPITOL HILL Senators have begun arguing the pros and cons of various immigration proposals.

                      Alabama Senator Jeff Sessions says a fence along the U-S border to keep illegal immigrants out is a good idea. He says he's reminded of the phrase "good fences make good neighbors."

                      He says the proposal for guest worker programs amounts to amnesty because it puts illegal immigrants on a path to citizenship.

                      Senator Edward Kennedy disagrees. He argues the guest worker program allows illegal immigrants to earn citizenship through a lengthy process.

                      The Senate debate will begin with a bill that focuses on enforcement.

                      An alternative approved by the Senate Judiciary Committee which includes guest worker programs will be offered as an alternative.


                      • #56
                        Houston, just ask 12 million people to leave US to apply for Guest Worker status, and there will be an exodus of millions and millions leaving the country.. Are you serious?

                        Next, make the legislation too restrictive (only for agjobs, with 5 years of experience, for instance), and how you plan to register, run background checks and screen the rest (approx. 8-10 mln) who will still remain here?


                        • #57
                          Getting more interesting all the time, now its the Labor Union turn to chime in.

                          Now the Dems have to deal with the fact that one of their support base is against the guest worker program, just like the Reps have to deal with theirs. The union did support the citizenship path though.


                          • #58
                            It's either a compromise or too bad consequences for everyone.

                            Simple as that.


                            • #59
                              Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, who voted to approve the fence project, indicated he may change his mind based on a recent trip to the Southwest. He told reporters he had met with farmers as well as law enforcement officials and "no one in the room thought the wall would work, because if you build the wall, then you have to police the wall."

                              Nice to see the house majority leader contradict tancredo, alib and the rest of the kkk members.

                              Boehner is a good man and he will make compromises.


                              • #60
                                Living in a shadowy corner of heaven is a lot better than living in the nicest part of hell. Living in the shadows in the US is better than living in most of the countries of origin of aliens. 4 dollars an hour isn't much, but it's a **** of a lot better than 4 dollars a day (a 10 hour day)
                                Have a nice day


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