Divorce and Sponsor's obligation...please need help

[Klavier]

Originally posted by davdah:
Klavier,
I read the case of stump v stump. Did it matter to you that Mr stump has a child he is taking care of, not from her. I guess Ms stump didn't care about that. She just wanted to get as much as she can. Doesn't matter that a child is going to suffer because of this. She got her GC and a bunch of loot, hooray. meanwhile a USC child may be starving. These are the kinds of actions that cause a lot of people to want to close the borders. No appreciation for what you do have already. Do you think for one second you would be 'awarded' these kinds of benefits back in Russia or Ukraine. I don't think so.
Sleep well.

My friend said "consequences for his actions". I sleep very good. Since I am disabled, but cant get disabillity or any thing, I do need help finanshally.

My ex spouse earns $125,000/year.

His wife earns about $50,000/year.

There is no offspring.

Yes, I sleep good doing this, but thank you for your anwser.

[Sprint_girl07]

Here you go Verbalist..my original posting sometime back.

Of course things have happened since last postings.

The update however is:

Claimed he was never married to me then
Claimed that we were just common law then
Filed for annulment on Common Law marriage (lol) then
Filed that I defrauded him to get into US then
Claimed that I defrauded him saying that ...I could not bear him a child and I kept it from him when we married (BS of course and I have no problems) then
Now saying that we cannot be married as our marriage is void in UK. On the grounds that when we married in UK..he had to have a special marriage visa, and had to have government clearance to come and marry me first.
If you don't your marriage is void.
yes it is now, however prior to 2005 it wasn't. Laws changed in Feb 2005 I think the date was.

He is clasping at anything lol

Anyway...the non immigrant courts don't have a clue on immigration law and know anything about the affidavit and how legal it is.
USCIS told me that if for some reason he does not uphold his contract, (if I got myself into a situation like when we separated) then I can sue him as he broke the contract.
I won't go there unless I really have to.

I need my documents for various of reasons, so getting them is important.
It will prove so much.

He has tried having me deported with USCIS for fraud, they laughed at him of course, and told me there are no grounds whatsoever to even inquire to his claims.

My problem of course is the family courts, trying to convince them that I am legal here, that he is my sponsor, that the US Gov accepted that our marriage was legal, and that the affidavit was in fact signed by him amongst other important docs.

I would suggest to every immigrant to keep all your copies and docs somewhere very very safe, or copy them again and give them to someone else for safe keeping just in case.

[Hudson]

Originally posted by Sprint_girl07:
Here you go Verbalist..my original posting sometime back.

Of course things have happened since last postings.

The update however is:

Claimed he was never married to me then
Claimed that we were just common law then
Filed for annulment on Common Law marriage (lol) then
Filed that I defrauded him to get into US then
Claimed that I defrauded him saying that ...I could not bear him a child and I kept it from him when we married (BS of course and I have no problems) then
Now saying that we cannot be married as our marriage is void in UK. On the grounds that when we married in UK..he had to have a special marriage visa, and had to have government clearance to come and marry me first.
If you don't your marriage is void.
yes it is now, however prior to 2005 it wasn't. Laws changed in Feb 2005 I think the date was.

He is clasping at anything lol

Anyway...the non immigrant courts don't have a clue on immigration law and know anything about the affidavit and how legal it is.
USCIS told me that if for some reason he does not uphold his contract, (if I got myself into a situation like when we separated) then I can sue him as he broke the contract.
I won't go there unless I really have to.

I need my documents for various of reasons, so getting them is important.
It will prove so much.

He has tried having me deported with USCIS for fraud, they laughed at him of course, and told me there are no grounds whatsoever to even inquire to his claims.

My problem of course is the family courts, trying to convince them that I am legal here, that he is my sponsor, that the US Gov accepted that our marriage was legal, and that the affidavit was in fact signed by him amongst other important docs.

I would suggest to every immigrant to keep all your copies and docs somewhere very very safe, or copy them again and give them to someone else for safe keeping just in case.

Sprint Girl,
Some states recognize common law marriage. You will need to talk to your attorney about which documents you can obtain and what factors determine common law marriage. Not sure if you have done this, but you might want to think about if leases, car titles, credit cards, bank accounts, etc had joint names as husband and wife. However, your lawyer might need to send formal requests if your name has been deleted from the records. Furthermore, if you were legally married in another country, you can request that information through their consulate or embassy, but I don't know how much time that would require. Generally, courts here will recognize a marriage from another country if that marriage was valid through their legal standards.

[Verbalist]

Sun girl - as you can see your post has already generated a very able response from Hudson.

I've skimmed through your previous posts and responses and, although there are many issues involved, it seems that the "bone of contention" in your divorce case is the validity of the marriage. As you say - you can't get fast enough the copies of the documents filed with the USCIS, you can't convince the divorce court that your marriage was in good faith. Would you say it's a reasonable assessment of your problem?

If so, I' d suggest writing a letter to the District Director of USCIS asking for confirmation that the USCIS has adjudicated your case and has granted you the PR status based on valid marriage to US citizen. You may mention that he tried to have you deported and failed.

You've mention several times that you've talked to USCIS about your problems with your FOIA request and with the attempted deportation request by your ex-husband. If you can get the letter to the person you've talked to it may expedite the USCIS response.

It's sort of circuitous route but a statement from the USCIS that your marriage was valid for the immigration purposes (i.e. federal government) should resolve this matter once and for all.

Good luck.

[Sprint_girl07]

Hi,

Yes Davdah is right, my State recognizes common law marriage, that is not the problem.
Of course in the divorce it is as they will only base the date what my husband classes as common law, rather then the date that we officially married in UK. We had separation remember during the immigration stages.

Anyhow..USCIS do not recognize common law marriage as a way to immigrate.
We had to be legally married and my husband would not have been able to sponsor me if we were not.
I don't have to try and convince USCIS, as they put it to me...we gave you a GC..you are legally married, we will not deport you on the grounds of whatever story he comes up with, so don't worry.
But in the divorce courts...they don't know how immigration works, they do not know what the affidavit is, they don't know the legal forms and they have no clue whether a marriage in UK is legal here.
If I had the necessary documents and especially the ones where he signed and even copies of papers that showed he sponsored me, he claims that we are married where and when etc..
well basically the courts here will see what a liar he is and they will also see that I am here legally and my marriage is based off my marriage date not a date that he comes up with.(yes this does affect your assets too)
I have the original marriage license, which my new lawyer said that my husband cannot deny..but of course husband is coming up with all sorts of answers now, to make out our marriage is void.
USCIS can't help me they said..they told me I should have kept copies to myself, or wait 16 months for them.
Husband stole the important ones including the affidavit.
I do have a case to sue him in Fed court if I wanted to, there is a lot more to it but don't want to post here about it.

I find it so annoying that courts don't seem to know much about immigration law, even the attorney general in my State admitted to me he was still learning himself.
My husband will have to prove this and that, but it would be so much easier that if I had those documents, the judge will know straight away what is legal and who is lying.

[Hudson]

Originally posted by Sprint_girl07:
Hi,

Yes Davdah is right, my State recognizes common law marriage, that is not the problem.
Of course in the divorce it is as they will only base the date what my husband classes as common law, rather then the date that we officially married in UK. We had separation remember during the immigration stages.

Anyhow..USCIS do not recognize common law marriage as a way to immigrate.
We had to be legally married and my husband would not have been able to sponsor me if we were not.
I don't have to try and convince USCIS, as they put it to me...we gave you a GC..you are legally married, we will not deport you on the grounds of whatever story he comes up with, so don't worry.
But in the divorce courts...they don't know how immigration works, they do not know what the affidavit is, they don't know the legal forms and they have no clue whether a marriage in UK is legal here.
If I had the necessary documents and especially the ones where he signed and even copies of papers that showed he sponsored me, he claims that we are married where and when etc..
well basically the courts here will see what a liar he is and they will also see that I am here legally and my marriage is based off my marriage date not a date that he comes up with.(yes this does affect your assets too)
I have the original marriage license, which my new lawyer said that my husband cannot deny..but of course husband is coming up with all sorts of answers now, to make out our marriage is void.
USCIS can't help me they said..they told me I should have kept copies to myself, or wait 16 months for them.
Husband stole the important ones including the affidavit.
I do have a case to sue him in Fed court if I wanted to, there is a lot more to it but don't want to post here about it.

I find it so annoying that courts don't seem to know much about immigration law, even the attorney general in my State admitted to me he was still learning himself.
My husband will have to prove this and that, but it would be so much easier that if I had those documents, the judge will know straight away what is legal and who is lying.

Sprint Girl,
From your statements, it sounds like you are in a nasty contested divorce or other legal case. It also sounds like you have a green card based, presumably, on marriage. So, you need to concentrate on proving your marriage was valid. USCIS info can help you. Furthermore, you can obtain a copy of your decisions filing form I-824. The cost is $360. This will help you in your divorce/annulment/legal case with your husband because it would show that you went through immigration based on family/marriage. Furthermore, contacting the British embassy or consulate, which I think either you are he is from, would help prove your marriage was valid (and I believe you did state you were married in that country). Common law marriage is also valid in some states. If that is the case in your state, then your lawyer should request information to the leasing agencies, title companies, previous joint accounts, etc to show that joint accounts did exist at one point when the two of you were cohabitating. It is going to cost you, but it is well worth it.

What your husband is doing is typical of some people. Remember, all you need to prove that your marriage was valid. Any of the options available will prove that marriage was valid. The court is just looking for some legal document such as a marriage certificate, proof of a valid common law marriage, or proper immigration documents. Your lawyer just needs to explain that immigration document proves valid marriage. Good luck.

[Sprint_girl07]

Thanks Davdah and Hudson,

Yes I think I will have to rely on an Immigration lawyer to help me explain to judge about the rules etc.. Just hope he takes the his word for it.

Hudson... very complicated, and hard to obtain those records to help me.
First..money is a problem for me right now..living off $500 a month for food and things so paying out that kind of money for documents is very hard right now.

Joint accounts etc...well again another problem.
The house which was purchased soon after marriage, with my money from England (deposit)..as I was not here to sign at the time, only has his name on it. Through discovery we found that not only my name is not on it, he also put himself down as single not married.
Another asset that my money was used to put the deposit on...I was there that time, even signed some documents, but recently found out that again, my name was never put on the deed, AND he claimed himself as single not married. (yes I know I am stupid for not checking, but that was part of his control).
Nearly every asset since marriage, all has single on them, and found that he never put my name on anything.
No joint bank accounts as he never allowed me to have access to our money.
I do however have 2 assets with my name on them, but they are more recent and I was there so I had to sign them.
Tax returns...all forged signatures on them as I never saw them or signed any.
We don't really have anything that has both of our names on them, even USCIS thought this was strange when we went for interview, but husband of course came up with excuses.

Even though USCIS do believe it was a valid marriage, what worries me of course is that if the divorce courts think that our marriage is not valid or they do not understand about immigration laws, what if they class our marriage as common law?
How does that affect me with USCIS then? Who has the overall say on deciding whether my marriage was legal or not?
Not sure if anyone else has come across this or not during a divorce, but it sure ****s that family courts don't have much clue on immigration and marriages abroad. With all the immigrants in this country for hundreds of years, why don't they learn anything?

I spoke to British Embassy, unfortunately they can't help me. They said that if USCIS have accepted my marriage as legal, then that is that. They also said that my marriage certificate is the proof that we are legally married.
I have also tried to obtain a copy of marriage laws in England prior to Feb 2005.
I have written and emailed various places in England, and online, yet everything is about the new laws or a registered office marriage.
We were married in a church.

Sooo complicated and keep hitting walls.
USCIS say you are married and you are legal, no worries.
Yet on the other side...well we don't know. If only I had all my paperwork.
My husband did this on purpose knowing full well that I would need those papers for the divorce court if I left him.
Sorry for long post..its sooo fraustrating.

Isn't it funny..I am probably one of the few people who are not trying to convince USCIS, but trying to convince the family courts.

[Hudson]

Originally posted by Sprint_girl07:
Thanks Davdah and Hudson,

Yes I think I will have to rely on an Immigration lawyer to help me explain to judge about the rules etc.. Just hope he takes the his word for it.

Hudson... very complicated, and hard to obtain those records to help me.
First..money is a problem for me right now..living off $500 a month for food and things so paying out that kind of money for documents is very hard right now.

Joint accounts etc...well again another problem.
The house which was purchased soon after marriage, with my money from England (deposit)..as I was not here to sign at the time, only has his name on it. Through discovery we found that not only my name is not on it, he also put himself down as single not married.
Another asset that my money was used to put the deposit on...I was there that time, even signed some documents, but recently found out that again, my name was never put on the deed, AND he claimed himself as single not married. (yes I know I am stupid for not checking, but that was part of his control).
Nearly every asset since marriage, all has single on them, and found that he never put my name on anything.
No joint bank accounts as he never allowed me to have access to our money.
I do however have 2 assets with my name on them, but they are more recent and I was there so I had to sign them.
Tax returns...all forged signatures on them as I never saw them or signed any.
We don't really have anything that has both of our names on them, even USCIS thought this was strange when we went for interview, but husband of course came up with excuses.

Even though USCIS do believe it was a valid marriage, what worries me of course is that if the divorce courts think that our marriage is not valid or they do not understand about immigration laws, what if they class our marriage as common law?
How does that affect me with USCIS then? Who has the overall say on deciding whether my marriage was legal or not?
Not sure if anyone else has come across this or not during a divorce, but it sure ****s that family courts don't have much clue on immigration and marriages abroad. With all the immigrants in this country for hundreds of years, why don't they learn anything?

I spoke to British Embassy, unfortunately they can't help me. They said that if USCIS have accepted my marriage as legal, then that is that. They also said that my marriage certificate is the proof that we are legally married.
I have also tried to obtain a copy of marriage laws in England prior to Feb 2005.
I have written and emailed various places in England, and online, yet everything is about the new laws or a registered office marriage.
We were married in a church.

Sooo complicated and keep hitting walls.
USCIS say you are married and you are legal, no worries.
Yet on the other side...well we don't know. If only I had all my paperwork.
My husband did this on purpose knowing full well that I would need those papers for the divorce court if I left him.
Sorry for long post..its sooo fraustrating.

Isn't it funny..I am probably one of the few people who are not trying to convince USCIS, but trying to convince the family courts.

Sprint Girl,
I forgot to mention that you can request a waiver of filing fees when you apply for the I-864. Second, money transfers leave a paper trail. You can request the paperwork from the title company about the purchase of the property or from your former bank in England. Also, contact your embassy or consulate about this legal situation and what information they can provide or request on your behalf. YOu need to be clear on what help you are needing. That is, you need help on how to obtain document from either government or private companies that has arisen from a legal dispute between you and your husband. if you filed jointly on yoru federal and/or state income tax return, you can request it by either calling IRS at 1-800-829-1040 or filing form 4506-T.

and remember, keep looking up. Do not oweey so much about what may happen in the future. Concentrate on the task at hand.

[Sprint_girl07]

Thank you Hudson and Davdah, some of the information I think I will pursue again and hope this time I might come up trumps.

The church in England only gives you a certificate, I already had someone speak to them for me, and the registery book has not yet been handed over to the Marriage records office as they wait until its completely full (it takes years).
They told me that the certificate is a valid and legal document so there is nothing else that I can prove that we were married. I also have the original license to get married, but of coruse my ex is claiming he did not have the capacity to marry me at the time (pathetic) lol

I know I shouldn't worry..but if you knew of my case..you would not believe the amount of mistakes that have happened, the screw ups in the courts and the ignorance of not understanding foreign marriages or immigration.
I have to put my faith in this justice system, and so far too many mistakes have happened, and of course with ex having control of all our paperwork (and not handing it over in discovery) well...I need to obtain proof elsewhere, and just in case I do need to convince the judge.

I did have a paper trail..unfortunately he has it..but of course denies it.
A lot of the money that I gave was cash (including money given as wedding gifts)..yes silly me. It was the easiest way to convert the money to dollars and he took it back with him. He also states that he paid me back all the money...yet he will have to prove that.
I have tried writing to my bank and other creditors, but unfortunately because the address they had was our business address (he demanded that the house address must not be given out to them)..and that my name was my maiden name at the time...well I could be anyone and there is the data protection act in UK.
They said they would send info to the address that was on file...but guess what....I cannot get my mail redirected to me house.
The Postal service in the US will not redirect mail from a business address to a resident address,not unless the business closes down.
So I cannot obtain my mail from England..and my husband denies that he gets any there...you know suddenly from the day of separation I receive no more mail there now.
Why is everything so complicated! lol

[Sprint_girl07]

Plan B.. LOL I better not reply to that one in case he ever finds this and accuses me of something else lol

I think I will go ahead and try and fill another form out this time at my local office. They originally told me that I had to go to the office located near the business to do it.
The thing is the address comes up as the shopping Mall address, hence why they noticed the first time round. When they put it in the computer it throws it out.
But you never know, my country small town office might have an old system hopefully and will not notice lol

Umm sending myself a letter? Probably have to get someone else to send it from not near me, just in case he does open it and accuses me of sending mail there, and will work against my PO against him. He will try anything. he might well forge something on it to make out that I sent it to him rather then to me. (that is how he works).

The problem with discovery is that he will only give it to us if he admits to having these documents. Funny how so many documents are not available or certain pages are missing.
Now claims that old bank account from back then is not available anymore. Yeah right.
As you can see we have a lot of work on our hands, well my lawyer does. It might end up being loads of subpoenas to companies which costs a fortune as it has to go by special certified mail via the court.

I swear I need a PI for this divorce..or FBI...he is soooo tricky!

[omozon]

Originally posted by davdah:
To SprintGirl
The idea of 125% above poverty is too low a bar. It should be set to the median for the state for the sponsor.

You're talking about $30,000-$50,000/year, right?
Don't you think it would provide huge economical incentive for unskilled uneducated immigrant to sue the sponsor and receive lifetime salary instead of working? It would be similar to tax bracket with 100% rate on everything below $50,000 and 0% on everything above $50,000.

[4now]

Originally posted by omozon:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
To SprintGirl
The idea of 125% above poverty is too low a bar. It should be set to the median for the state for the sponsor.

You're talking about $30,000-$50,000/year, right?
Don't you think it would provide huge economical incentive for unskilled uneducated immigrant to sue the sponsor and receive lifetime salary instead of working? It would be similar to tax bracket with 100% rate on everything below $50,000 and 0% on everything above $50,000. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Now why should it be set for the state???? This is a federal guideline. No individual state to make it up. It is federal immigration standards. that would be a disaster if immigration was state regulated. It is already bad enough that some states have their own criteria such as those that issue drivers license etc to illegal immigrants. Imagine if they were given the power to govern the i-864.



Omaron

sue the sponser and receive lifetime salary lol

1st and foremost.. sponsership is only in place for a maximum of 40 qtrs work(approx 10 yrs).

and what are you referring to when speaking about 30k-50k. ?

[omozon]

Originally posted by 4now:
1st and foremost.. sponsership is only in place for a maximum of 40 qtrs work(approx 10 yrs).

and what are you referring to when speaking about 30k-50k. ?

You misinterpret idea of 40 quarters. It means that sponsor's obligation to support immigrant ends when immigrant has accamulated 40 quarters (worked for 10 years). But sponsored immigrant doesn't have to work because of sponsor's obligation to maintain his on her income on certain level.

This is a median income per capita for the state which SprintGirl suggested to set instead of 125% poverty rule.

[Sprint_girl07]

Davdah,

Power of Attorney thing, is very complicated and not easy to do, but my friend is going to look into it more and find out the legal requirements for me. The thing is of course I need money to do all that too, which I don't at present. But thank you, it has given me an idea though.

[Sprint_girl07]

Davdah wrote:
What I was getting at was not just the financial quality of the sponsor but both. The would be immigrant should be able to demonstrate the ability to support themselves with or without the sponsor.

Remove temptation for free support from the equation. Fraud would dry up over night. There would need to be some provisions to account for abuse on both sides but the way it is now its too easy to take the wrong path if the moral compass goes astray,

.....

I partly agree with you there Davdah, but I can see problems that could occur with this.
For one it won't stop fraud, for example I know a number of USC's for example who have married an immigrant for convenience, 2 of which who received money for marrying the immigrant. The immigrants are financially well off, so in return the USC will have some nice income in return for the marriage etc.
It does happen, and happens a lot. It happens in every country. Hard to stop that kind of fraud really.

The other problems are...what if an immigrant has an injury or an illness. They won't be able to work anymore or for a long period of time.
What about an immigrant woman who has young children with the USC, she is a stay at home mum, then finds herself in a situation where she cannot do full time work. She wouldn't have enough income to live on. The USC children would by rights be entitled to support or even benefits, but the immigrant would not for a time period (the 5 yr rule).
The thing is, no one knows what the future holds, we can't say what will happen in the 10 yrs after receiving the GC. The first 5 yrs after the GC is the crucial time period. Hence why they put that rule there. And don't forget that is usually where fraudsters/scammers would usually separate for divorce.
I agree its not fair for the USC who has been scammed by an immigrant, and will still be responsible for 10 yrs, unless of course the fraud can be proved.
There I think there should be something in place, they need to revise that part.
However, what about the thousands of immigrants who are not scammers, there has to be a safety net for them. Remember we are not allowed to have any government help, we are not entitled to so many things until we are a Citizen.

If they took my date of when I moved here rather then whey I received my GC, I could be a Citizen by now. My sponsor (husband) would be free from the affidavit.

There should be changes, and there should be clauses too, in case of fraud.