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  • Koller,

    It was eye-opening the extreme measures they are using to push Health Care Reform. Setting up a town hall meeting in a remote location and then bringing in busloads of Obama supporters to make it look like this bill is the best thing since sliced bread. A town hall should be an open forum where people from all walks of life are openingly invited - not a set stage to
    make it look like the overwhelming majority of Americans support the reform in its current format.

    Comment


    • Get off the drugs to see the hidden message !!! The socialist monger is destroying US of A !!! Idiots like you cannot comprehend the message !!!

      Comment


      • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ProudUSC:
        Koller,

        It was eye-opening the extreme measures they are using to push Health Care Reform. Setting up a town hall meeting in a remote location and then bringing in busloads of Obama supporters to make it look like this bill is the best thing since sliced bread. A town hall should be an open forum where people from all walks of life are openingly invited - not a set stage to
        make it look like the overwhelming majority of Americans support the reform in its current format. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

        Leadership is particularly necessary to ensure ready acceptance of the unfamiliar and that which is contrary to tradition.

        Cyril Falls, American Historian
        “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

        Comment


        • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SonofMicheal:
          Get off the drugs to see the hidden message !!! The socialist monger is destroying US of A !!! Idiots like you cannot comprehend the message !!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

          Until I think of and have something equally stupid to say - I'll just skip you!

          Tootle-loo!!
          “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

          Comment


          • The statutory health insurance (SHI) is in addition to the pension, unemployment, accident and nursing care component of the German social security system and is part of the health system.

            Contents
            1 Tasks and structure
            2 Insurance law basics
            2.1 Compulsorily
            2.2 Voluntary insured
            2.3 Familiy insured
            3 Performance of the statutory health insurance
            3.1 Excess
            3.2 Relief in cases of hardship
            4 Financing / Contributions
            4.1 Contribution
            4.2 Compulsorily especially workers
            4.3 Voluntary professional independent
            5 Issues
            5.1 Hospital treatment
            5.2 Medicines
            5.3 Psychotherapy
            5.4 Medical treatment
            5.5 Therapeutic
            5.6 Administrative costs
            6 Insured structure
            7 Change of health insurance and differences to PKV
            8 Differences between statuatory and private health insurance
            9 See also
            10 sources
            11 References
            12 Web Links

            I've been looking into this, I have forgotten alot, because it's been so long - however, if they would implement something like they have in Germany.

            The country just can't go wrong!

            Section 8 differences between statuatory and private health insurance is what most would be interested in learning about - I guess.

            I wished people wouldn't be afraid of it.

            BTW: The government doesn't pay anything, except if unemployed and than it's linked to UI through the state.
            “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

            Comment


            • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SonofMicheal:
              Get off the drugs to see the hidden message !!! The socialist monger is destroying US of A !!! Idiots like you cannot comprehend the message !!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

              Spoken like a true idiot that knows nothing and fears everything.
              "What you see in the photograph isn't what you saw at the time. The real skill of photography is organized visual lying."

              Comment


              • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kollerkrot:
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SonofMicheal:
                Get off the drugs to see the hidden message !!! The socialist monger is destroying US of A !!! Idiots like you cannot comprehend the message !!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                Until I think of and have something equally stupid to say - I'll just skip you!

                Tootle-loo!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                USA tricky Also! trying To Protect Thje very Place Many deemed Necessary!!! Som Has Never Been wrong In The facts!!! I Am open Minded and Seeking solutions To this catastrophy myself! Immigrants dreamed Of New, something different, New life! why Put trust In something that Is catastrophic!!! You Want To reside In USA? Become USA!!! Prevent Those That are Not Of your same morals and values from entering!!!

                The typos = my hands have been Cut over 1000 times, The tendons and tissue not Able to be profectionist!!! Not yet authritis. Close! Every Job = Bleeder!!! Paper cut? Artery Cut? Tendon cut, part of the The job!!! I Am not copnnected To anyone On ILW! Yet Som has never lied!!!! Sad But true!!! Can We Get Tahat Back???????
                USC and Legal, Honest Immigrant Alike Must Fight Against Those That Deceive and Disrupt A Place Of Desirability! All Are Victims of Fraud, Both USC and Honest Immigrant Alike! The bad can and does make it more difficult for the good! Be careful who y

                Comment


                • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">There is one thing you forgot to mention. You see, given the fact these people had to file bankruptcy goes to show they received the operation they needed to save their life. There is a difference between ours and the proposed rationed versions that exist elsewhere. With rationed care there will be a percentage of it's members who didn't qualify and subsequently a little worse off, dead. I think I'll take a BK over room temperature any day. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                  If you really think that then I guess it's hardly worth making all that money as you'll loose it. The whole problem with healthcare is you never know if you'll need it. I'd rather have a safety net I know I can use than gamble loosing all my money. What about pre-existing conditions? Isn't that rationing too? When you're younger, you don't think about the what if's. That comes later in life.
                  "What you see in the photograph isn't what you saw at the time. The real skill of photography is organized visual lying."

                  Comment


                  • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by davdah:
                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kollerkrot:
                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ProudUSC:
                    Koller,

                    It was eye-opening the extreme measures they are using to push Health Care Reform. Setting up a town hall meeting in a remote location and then bringing in busloads of Obama supporters to make it look like this bill is the best thing since sliced bread. A town hall should be an open forum where people from all walks of life are openingly invited - not a set stage to
                    make it look like the overwhelming majority of Americans support the reform in its current format. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                    Leadership is particularly necessary to ensure ready acceptance of the unfamiliar and that which is contrary to tradition.

                    Cyril Falls, American Historian </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


                    There in is the error. This is not like a military command where you have to follow orders or else. The president along with every other elected official are supposed to represent our wishes and desires, not theirs, or some special interest group. They work for us. They are to do what we want, not what they want. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                    But, Davdah, it is the majority that does want it. I am pulling along side them, because I know what it is and how it can work and so is Brit and Sprint. I don't think my freedom is going to be enslaved, I actually think it will be enhanced.

                    However, if the majority of the people in the country does not want it, it won't be passed. I have no worries - I have been living with and without health insurance here. Right now I have none, because I don't want to pay all the money and not get anything for it - I am extremely low risk - I'd be paying all this money for, who? I rather pay cash and go to the doctor of my choice and not the network that the insurance tells me to go to for $400 a month w/o chiropractic care. Naahhh!!
                    “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                    Comment


                    • I know the majority of the American people want it, because they know other developed countries in the world do have it. They do want it, because of the portability issue. Not that I want to mention all the problems that I have observed prior and already mentioned above, with only the private sector providing for profit health insurance. The groups are tied to employers, cobra only works if your next employer doesn't offer any health insurance or if you are out of work entirely and then only for 18 months (I think). If you change jobs, you health insurance does not go with you. All the money that you paid into it (a cheaper plan and you didn't use the doctors/drugs - $4,800 lost. If you go to a slightly better plan, probably $7,200 lost annually. BCBS and Aetna as example aren't exactly blood bothers - are they? If you are insured with the government, it travels with you - you can job hopp if you like and you still have adequate insurance. There are so many good reasons for the government to get envolved. I am sure I can think of many many more.

                      It is not free - he doesn't say that. Everybody will be paying for their health insurance just like they do know. If you do pay in more, because you make more you'll be classified differently and you do get better service. Just like now with the HMOs vs. the Choice Plans.

                      I talked to a friend last night in Germany. I asked it's 50/50 employer/employee with a cap on income. If you loose your job, you still have health insurance, but you have to look at that most people will have paid in some funds into the "fund" at some point in time and are not living of the state entirely. If the majority members of a fund have to carry some members during off times, it will not heard the fund. Also, these funds are invested in the market and although the government is at the helm of them, these funds are set up as corporate bodies/legal entities under the law and can do that. They gain in value and they are virtually never low in funds. In Germany, from what I hear the government is acutally using these funds to invest or borrowing against them. So, more capital/less debt for the government! Maybe America will be able to set the Chinese free? That has a nice ring to it - doesn't it?
                      “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                      Comment


                      • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">If you are insured with the government, it travels with you - you can job hopp if you like and you still have adequate insurance. There are so many good reasons for the government to get envolved. I am sure I can think of many many more. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                        This is true with any job as long as you are still working for the same employer. I had many different jobs with Verizon, but always maintained the same health insurance. The insurance provided to government workers is the same as with any other employer. The insurers come from the private sector (i.e., Blue Cross/Blue Shield, Aetna, UnitedHealthcare). There is no government-provided insurance as yet. Having never worked for the government, I don't know what proportion of costs the employee is expected to pay, but I'm pretty sure it's not free.

                        Employers are able to get group rates from the insurance companies, thus lower costs for the employers. However, there are individual health care plans available too. Granted, the costs are higher, but the availability is there. I just checked to see what the cost would be for one of my sons (if he didn't have insurance through the company) and it would cost him $170/mo. for a plan that has $500 deductible, 20% Co-pay and $35 office visit. While it is expensive, it is still there if he needed it.

                        Comment


                        • I found a table that lists the how much government workers must pay for insurance based on their provider and state. The government is treating their employers much better in this respect than Verizon was when I left.

                          http://www.opm.gov/insure/heal...nonpostalhmo2009.pdf

                          Comment


                          • How can it be freedom when your health insurance is tied to your employer? Or handing over large sums of $$ if you're self-employed because you don't have any financial clout?
                            I just don't get this freedom thing that davdah claims

                            There are many people who are tied to a job they don't like because of the health insurance. It might not be for them either. It may be to maintain treatment for a loved one. My immediate boss is one of those.

                            Surely a public option gives you freedom in that you have no worries about not being insured or under-insured and have true portability. Change job? It doesn't matter anywhere in the country. That's real freedom to me.
                            "What you see in the photograph isn't what you saw at the time. The real skill of photography is organized visual lying."

                            Comment


                            • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ProudUSC:
                              I found a table that lists the how much government workers must pay for insurance based on their provider and state. The government is treating their employers much better in this respect than Verizon was when I left.

                              http://www.opm.gov/insure/heal...nonpostalhmo2009.pdf </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                              I figure that has to do with the number of insured in the group. I googled Verizon and it brought up 260,000 employees nationwide. The group that you belonged to at Verizon, I gather is the Washington D.C. group.

                              These funds would work best and are cheapest with large amounts of people paying in. The bigger the fund the better - naturally (bigger is better after all, hmmmm!)
                              “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                              Comment


                              • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Brit4064:
                                How can it be freedom when your health insurance is tied to your employer? Or handing over large sums of $$ if you're self-employed because you don't have any financial clout?
                                I just don't get this freedom thing that davdah claims

                                There are many people who are tied to a job they don't like because of the health insurance. It might not be for them either. It may be to maintain treatment for a loved one. My immediate boss is one of those.

                                Surely a public option gives you freedom in that you have no worries about not being insured or under-insured and have true portability. Change job? It doesn't matter anywhere in the country. That's real freedom to me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                Tell him Brit....and he'd be able to remain a Repub too. True freedom!
                                “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                                Comment

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