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Bush's Temporary Working Program

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  • E.
    replied
    Acelaw, you know VERY well what I am talking about.
    The LAW that is not enforced is no better than a PAPER.
    I said ACT not TALK.
    Congress has the power to enact the law that will FORCE ALL LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES in US to cooperate and enforce the Immigration Laws within the border.
    AND DON'T TELL ME IT CAN'T BE DONE!
    JUST LOOK AT I.R.S. !!!

    This talk(about illegals and not enforcing the law) is useless and is good only for those who benefit from cursing them.

    Good thing would be to ACT, one way or another.

    And, Acelaw, you know well what I mean when I say "double message".
    I mean THE FACT that for many years there are contradictory laws that are debated in congress regarding this issue and none ever gets passed.

    So, what a young, 16 year old must think when there is a DREAM Act that has bipartisan support on one hand and at the same time a CLEAR ACT , and none actually ever signed to law.
    Should he wait, hope for DREAM ACT to be enacted or should he leave before CLEAR ACT, avoiding unesessary arrest and humiliating enforcement of the immigration law?

    Now, when there is no action but only contradictory talk-that is what "double message" is!

    And BY THE WAY, ACELAW, LEARN TO READ!!!
    I AM NOT A MEXICAN AND I DID NOT CROSS BORDER ILLEGALLY!!!!

    Great Lord!
    No wonder you can't comprehend and respond to simple postings, leave alone the "complicated" ones like this one.

    Leave a comment:


  • acelaw
    replied
    E.
    How much clearer do you need the law then this ?


    Under Title 8 Section 1325 of the U.S. Code, "Improper Entry by Alien," any citizen of any country other than the United States who:

    Enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers; or

    Eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers; or

    Attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact;
    has committed a federal crime.

    Violations are punishable by criminal fines and imprisonment for up to six months. Repeat offenses can bring up to two years in prison. Additional civil fines may be imposed at the discretion of immigration judges, but civil fines do not negate the criminal sanctions or nature of the offense

    It should not send out double signal to the community, closing its eyes on illegal aliens on one hand and promising to CLEAR them all on the other.
    That is not right.

    We have increased the budget of INS/BICE to 7 Billion from
    $500,000 in 1975 to try and stop this , we do not have unlimited resources to spend here so where is the double signal we send ? We have a law , we have a well defined border , none of it maters to those who break into this country and overrun our security services then blame us for there actions,that victim hood thing again HUH?We forced you to come and violate our laws. LOLOL

    Leave a comment:


  • AliBA
    replied
    We already have had national polls (Gallup and such) which show Americans want less immigration overall and no amnesty for illegal aliens. But that doesn't matter to Congress and other public officials. They get most of their money (campaign funds, lobbying jobs after they're out of Congress, etc.) from special interests such as corporations and ethnic lobbies. Even with a jobless recovery, Bush's White House is trying to "spin" a "guest worker" program as something the U.S. needs. Now, instead of "filling jobs Americans won't do", the White House is trying to convince the public that if only we legalize illegal aliens, that will increase security. How such a program would accomplish this is open to question. Most wouldn't sign up if it means a chance they'd have to return home after 3 or 6 years. If they're violent criminals or terrorists, they probably wouldn't show up anyway. Without security checks (which would divert manpower away from other terrorism efforcts) and enforcement (actually going after people who don't sign up and deporting them), a "guest worker" program accomplishes nothing. Certainly nothing that couldn't be done without the expense and delays that such a program would create.

    Leave a comment:


  • E.
    replied
    I think government must be clear and consistent in its intentions and implementation of its laws.
    It should not send out double signal to the community, closing its eyes on illegal aliens on one hand and promising to CLEAR them all on the other.
    That is not right.
    It actually demoralizes both the Law Enforcement and Citizens, and confuses those Illegal aliens who don't know what to expect and thus hopelessly wait for solution that never comes.
    I would support ANY swift, honest and CLEAR decision, whatever it be.
    If it is CLEAR Act then let's be clear about it.
    If it is Temporary or Permanent Residence-then let us make that clear to everyone.
    I am sure if government was consistent and sent steady, firm handed message, many of the illegals would leave voluntarily knowing that there is no future for them in the States.
    And the Law Enforcement could then focus on those stubborn and foolish lawbreakers who still ignored its' demands to leave.
    That is all I have to say.
    And that is why I said earlier:this should not go on for too long.

    I would also suggest to inform public about the facts, costs of legalizing and deporting illegals, benefits of doing the either one. And then hold Nationwide polls and let congress take the will of people into account.And ACT.ACT whatever action it might be.
    ACT but not uselessly talk or deliberate for a decade.

    That is all I can say.

    Leave a comment:


  • AliBA
    replied
    Sammy--Enforcement could be stepped up against employers, thereby drying up jobs illegal aliens hold. No need for deportation. No work, no welfare, no way to support yourself here. Many, if not most, will leave.

    Leave a comment:


  • acelaw
    replied
    You have the clear act that has passed the house that will make states enforce Federal law, how would this violate civil liberties?


    The CLEAR Act of 2003
    Posted by niel (October 31, 2003 01:59 PM)
    The Clear Law Enforcement for Criminal Alien Removal Act of 2003, sponsored by Rep. Charlie Norwood (R-GA), would encourage local and state police departments to "investigate, apprehend, detain, or remove aliens" discovered in the course of their normal law enforcement duties. This encouragement would come in the form of the witholding of funds that would otherwise be allocated to the state or locality under other laws.
    Most of the opposition to this legislation has come from immigration advocacy groups; other groups have focused on the unfunded mandate requiring the use of state and local officials to enforce federal law.
    However, a much overlooked aspect of the legislation is the unprecedented step toward a police state in the United States. Under this legislation, every police officer would have the right "” indeed, the responsibility "” to ask anyone they stop in the routine performance of their duties for proof of their legal status. Presumably the police would use their judgement as to whether any individual was likely to be an illegal immigrant; I'll give you one guess as to which racial group is least likely to be asked for their passport or green card.
    The United States has never required that its citizens carry proof of their citizenship, and to give local police the ability to demand "your papers, please" is a dangerous step on the slippery slope towards a police state.

    Leave a comment:


  • SAMMY
    replied
    As far as this "Guest Worker" program goes, then I believe you guys should know the following:

    [1] This "Guest Worker" program that President Bush has suggested is NOT an immigrant visa or a green card so that people could live here permanently. Instead, it is a non-immigrant visa, which is temporary in nature, and would be good for 3 yrs only, but it can be extended one more time for another 3 yrs if alien can fulfill its further requirements for its extension. There won't be any automatic extension on this after first 3 yrs of its validity. With that in fact, aliens will be allowed to stay for maximum six year. This guest worker program won't lead them to have green card automatically in the future as many of them heard from lots of people. Because, in order to have permanent visa or green card, aliens still need to be sponsored thru employer or family members as the way it is now. Thereby, lots of people and critics are questioning that what would happen after those 3 or 6 yrs? Will aliens be forced to leave the country? As you know, lots of people might be buying houses or cars if they are going to stay here for that long, and their children would be going to school too here during those years, so after those years, will they be forced to sell their houses, cars and would need to compromise their children's ongoing education? If these people, who are illegal here, wanted to live here for just 3-6 yrs only, then they would have returned back to their homeland already by now, rather than staying here illegally for that long. So, they are not here for 3-6 yrs only.

    [2] I heard lots of people saying this, and I also watched President Bush's statements time to time, wherein President Bush has been emphasizing on ˜family unification', but if this temporary visa is only for 3-6 yrs, then how would it unite the family, since lots of illegal aliens have families here who are either USC or LPR, like either spouse, children or parents, or siblings?

    [3] In order to be eligible for this "Guest Worker" visa, aliens still need an employer to sponsor them, and employer still needs to go thru all the requirements with U.S. Labor Dept wherein employer will need to prove to Labor Dept. that there is no qualified Americans for that particular job, and employer will also need to provide the proofs that they are able to provide the prevailing wages to aliens if aliens are allowed to work for them. So, my point is-isn't it the same requirements are needed for Immigrant visa? If someone has to go thru all these things then why they will settle for nonimmigrant visa, when they can go for immigrant visa for a permanent right to live here? How this ˜guest worker' program is differed than employment based green card when the formalities and requirements are same? I don't think that- illegal people who are here for so long would come out of shadow just for stay here for 3-6 yrs only, because they are not looking to live here legally for 3-6 yrs, especially when they will know that they will end up in the same situation after 3-6 yrs where they are now. I think they are looking for some kind of permanent legal status. But the truth is, President Bush has made very clear in his State of the Union address that his administration is not going to grant blanket amnesty to illegal, because then it would undermine our immigration laws, and it would be a reward to those who broke our laws deliberately, and it will encourage illegal immigration.

    [4] I heard lots of people saying that why this program is introduced only now when election is around the corner? Why it was not introduced before when President Bush had enough time [4 yrs] to bring this up? Critics are saying that it is purely a political move to get mostly Latino votes.

    [5] As you know this is only a proposal, and nothing else. As well, I am sure that nothing will happen this year on this proposal. As you know-they have debated 245(i) since 2001 and still there is nothing on that, so you can guess how long it will take. And, there is no guarantee either that the Bill for this proposal will ever be passed in the Congress. Matter of fact, it is seemed that it will never pass in the Congress, because even mostly Republicans are against of this proposal. Truth of the matter is- the republican majority leader in the house- Tom Delay has said in an interview with CNN on 23rd of this month that he wants to see more restrictive version of this proposal. He wants every illegal aliens to go back to their country first and then apply from there for this guest worker program. He said that he would push very hard for this amendment into this proposal, because otherwise it will be same as if we are rewarding to lawbreakers, who broke our laws deliberately, regardless of this proposal is for nonimmigrant visa or immigrant visa. He was also stating that he is going to purpose another important amendment into it wherein he will purpose to enforce the immigration laws by local law enforcement agencies like Europe. As you know that once a law is made then no State can deny following the law because Federal laws always supercede State laws.

    I don't know if Govt. can deport every illegal, but I do know for sure that if other law enforcement agencies will enforce immigration laws, then govt. would be able to track down illegal in most of situation, as in Europe. But, I know this amendment would compromise civil liberty, but govt. will argue national interest and national security over civil liberty as they did on passing Patriot law. I guess we all need to wait for time, because Time will only tell what is going to happen in the future.

    Leave a comment:


  • Still Learning
    replied
    Why can't it go on for "long"? It's gone on for YEARS. I can see them trying to deport everyone.....

    Leave a comment:


  • E.
    replied
    President has done a great thing by bringing this problem into the focus of our Lawmakers.

    Now it is up to congress to decide how to deal with the presence of 10 mln undocumented population here.
    Whatever they decide, it should be done as soon as possible.
    For security reasons undocumented population should either be granted a temporary legal status or forcibly deported at once.
    This kind of situation can't go on for too long.

    Leave a comment:


  • chuck
    replied
    this only proposal at this time. tom daschel and chuck hagel have also made a proposal in senate which is more liberal. both are only proposed. they have to go thru complete process which is sometime in future if it gets that far. i have hope.

    Leave a comment:


  • charmie
    replied
    Does anyone of you know if the congress already approved the proposal of Pres.Bush???
    If yes, what will be the 1st thing to do to apply for the program?
    thank you

    Leave a comment:


  • charmie
    started a topic Bush's Temporary Working Program

    Bush's Temporary Working Program

    Does anyone of you know if the congress already approved the proposal of Pres.Bush???
    If yes, what will be the 1st thing to do to apply for the program?
    thank you
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