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Thread: Mayor (ATHENS, GA) says Mexico trip opened eyes on immigration..

  1. #1
    Mayor says Mexico trip opened eyes on immigration

    The Associated Press - ATHENS, Ga.

    Athens Mayor Heidi Davison says a University of Georgia-sponsored trip to Mexico has given her new empathy for Hispanic immigrants and a desire to lobby state and federal official to relax some immigration policies.

    Davison, along with about 15 other Georgia local officials from areas with large or growing Hispanic populations, spent two weeks in and around Monterrey and Veracruz.

    After seeing impoverished villages where nearly all the men are gone working in the United States, Davison said she came to the conclusion that "they are seeking a better life for their families, and specifically for their children. That's a natural human desire."

    Elected officials and UGA professors met with Mexican government officials and toured small towns and rural villages last month to better understand why thousands of Mexicans come to Georgia each year.

    "We came away with some pretty good ideas," said Gordon Maner, a public service assistant at UGA's Carl Vinson Institute of Government, who helped organized the trip.

    Davison said she will work to ease restrictions on employing immigrants, and fight proposed state laws taking benefits away from undocumented aliens.

    The Athens economy appears too dependent on the 6,000 to 12,000 Hispanic immigrants in Clarke County to bear such restrictions, she said.

    Employment rules are complicated, but federal law generally requires that employers pay alien workers a wage on par with U.S. citizens, and the employer must often pay fees to the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services office, which Davison said can encourage employment of undocumented aliens who can be paid less under the table while avoiding the fees.

    She said she will lobby Congress to expand the guest worker program, and wants to study in greater detail the impact of immigrants on the local economy.

    Many Hispanic immigrants in Athens work in the poultry and landscaping industries, but reliable statistics are few and far between on state and national levels, let alone for local economies.

    While the federal government controls who gets into the country, the state decides who gets what benefits, like driver's licenses, education, welfare and subsidized health insurance.

    Several bills in the state legislature would take many of those benefits away from undocumented aliens, an idea Davison said she opposes.

    "I don't think we should shut those services off," she said. "We need to continue to provide those services."

    ___

    HASH(0x1cdc358)

  2. #2
    Mayor says Mexico trip opened eyes on immigration

    The Associated Press - ATHENS, Ga.

    Athens Mayor Heidi Davison says a University of Georgia-sponsored trip to Mexico has given her new empathy for Hispanic immigrants and a desire to lobby state and federal official to relax some immigration policies.

    Davison, along with about 15 other Georgia local officials from areas with large or growing Hispanic populations, spent two weeks in and around Monterrey and Veracruz.

    After seeing impoverished villages where nearly all the men are gone working in the United States, Davison said she came to the conclusion that "they are seeking a better life for their families, and specifically for their children. That's a natural human desire."

    Elected officials and UGA professors met with Mexican government officials and toured small towns and rural villages last month to better understand why thousands of Mexicans come to Georgia each year.

    "We came away with some pretty good ideas," said Gordon Maner, a public service assistant at UGA's Carl Vinson Institute of Government, who helped organized the trip.

    Davison said she will work to ease restrictions on employing immigrants, and fight proposed state laws taking benefits away from undocumented aliens.

    The Athens economy appears too dependent on the 6,000 to 12,000 Hispanic immigrants in Clarke County to bear such restrictions, she said.

    Employment rules are complicated, but federal law generally requires that employers pay alien workers a wage on par with U.S. citizens, and the employer must often pay fees to the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services office, which Davison said can encourage employment of undocumented aliens who can be paid less under the table while avoiding the fees.

    She said she will lobby Congress to expand the guest worker program, and wants to study in greater detail the impact of immigrants on the local economy.

    Many Hispanic immigrants in Athens work in the poultry and landscaping industries, but reliable statistics are few and far between on state and national levels, let alone for local economies.

    While the federal government controls who gets into the country, the state decides who gets what benefits, like driver's licenses, education, welfare and subsidized health insurance.

    Several bills in the state legislature would take many of those benefits away from undocumented aliens, an idea Davison said she opposes.

    "I don't think we should shut those services off," she said. "We need to continue to provide those services."

    ___

    HASH(0x1cdc358)

  3. #3
    Maybe the mayor should take such trips to a few more countries, many of them more impoverished than Mexico, and see just how many BILLIONS would love to come here, if only for economic opportunity. Just how would she plan to accommodate all of THEM?! How would she plan to accommodate the 20 percent of Mexico's population that's willing to come here illegally (in addition to the 10 percent of its workforce that's already here)? The majority of Mexicans would also love to immigrate here, according to a recent poll by the Pew Hispanic Center. Where does she think the money will come from to support the social services all of them would need? The jobs, at decent wages, for ANYONE? And just why should Hispanics be given priority--which, in fact, they already have. Mexico is the single country sending the most LEGAL immigrants to the U.S., and has been for almost 20 years. Latin Americans account for almost half of all legal immigration. Why should these countries have a lock on immigration? And why should illegal immigration from these countries be ignored and even rewarded, while legal immigrants from other countries wait patiently to come here?

  4. #4
    With all the demagoguery and sophistry about "BILLIONS MORE TO COME" put aside, what do you think can be done about 12 mln. Illegal Immigrants already present in US, some with immediate relationship to US Citizens and LPR's?

    Bear in mind that 12 mln will not be deported.
    Only lunatics beleive that it can/will be done.

    I Am curious to hear a constructive proposals how to deal with facts/problems, realistic ones, not ones born in fantasy world.


    God bless you ALL!

  5. #5
    If we're going to talk about demagoguery and sophistry, then how about "baby waving"? Why is having a US citizen relative--spouse,an anchor baby, etc.-- supposed to guarantee one a free pass on observing our laws? I guess that means if someone doesn't have a US citizen relative, you think they should be deported.

    If we're going to talk about demagoguery and sophistry, then we have a prime example in this article: Poor, poor Mexicans, so poor that they deserve special treatment in our immigration enforcement. This article makes it sound like Mexico is the only poor country in the world, when it's not even one of the poorest. Actually, it's in the top third with respect to GDP. Its problem is mainly a government which won't collect the taxes owed it, and provide services to care for and educate its population. Also, roughly half of all illegals are visa overstays, and hardly the downtrodden of the earth. In order to even get nonimmigrant visas to the US, they have to prove they have the financial and family ties to their homelands so that they'll return--which makes them among the better off in their homelands.

    You want reasonable solutions? 12 million don't have to be deported. Apply sanctions to employers to dry up jobs, and let them leave of their own volition. Doing so would also remove the attraction for more to come.

    What definitely won't work--what has been proven not to work--is amnesty or "guest worker" programs. Or providing social services that enable illegal aliens to live here comfortably. We've tried that and it only encourages illegal immigration. Those illegals who have US born kids will just have to wait until those kids can sponsor them--if they don't leave first.

    Of course, Congress apparently is starting to take a good hard look at changing birthright citizenship, which would take care of that problem for future illegals.

  6. #6
    Aliba,

    First,
    I didn't ask "Why is having a US citizen relative--an anchor baby-- supposed to guarantee one a free pass on observing our laws?"

    Second,
    I envision that there will be very strict border control and funds allocated to enforce it in years to come, so I dismiss a rhetoric of "BILLIONS MORE TO COME" as a mere sophistry.

    The question I ask is: what is to be done about 12 mln.?

    The fact is they will not be deported.

    It is foolish to imagine that 12 mln. will pack their bags and self-deport themselves in responce to employer sanctions.
    It's not going to happen.
    At least those who risked their lives to come here from Mexico won't voluntarily go back in absence of possibility that they can soon return to States, no matter what sanctions placed on whom.
    It must have been worse than death for them in Mexico to cross the desert at the cost of risking their lives in the first place.
    Only fools don't understand this.

    Finally, what REALISTICALLY (not in fantasy world, where those LPR's and USC's "happily & voluntarily" leave to starve to death in Mexico or else), so what REALISTICALLY can be expected of those who have their USC children and LPR wives here?
    Who thinks THEY will self-deport??


    Thus, the question still remains: what to be done about these 12 mln. people already here, since they will not be deported or leave anyway?

  7. #7
    You're talking as if ALL illegal aliens are Mexican, another form of sophistry.

    Roughly half of all illegal aliens came here very comfortably on airplanes or legally through Canada. They're visa overstays.

    If employer sanctions don't work to remove those who entered illegally, THEN we can start deportations. Actually, you don't have to deport everyone, just enough that everyone wonders if it's going to be me next. Look what happened when the Border Patrol's picked people up in raids--scares illegal aliens to death, and these are just infrequent actions targeting criminal illegals. When they did special registration for men from terrorist countries, literally thousands of Pakistanis headed to Canada or elsewhere.

    When the illegals came here, they didn't have much to lose. But what is someone who's got a bank account, bought a house, or built a business going to do if he faces deportation? Is he going to wait to be deported? Risk confiscation or heavy fines ($500 a day fines are on the books, and haven't been used, but possibly could be).

  8. #8
    Now, I'll ask you a question. Just what would YOU do with illegal aliens that wouldn't encourage more to come here? You think stricter border controls are enough to stop people from lying to get visas and overstaying? Border controls, even walls, may discourage, but aren't anywhere near 100 percent effective. And why should we trust government to give an amnesty, then enforce the law with these controls, when they didn't last time? Makes far better sense to enforce laws without an amnesty, especially since the mere talk of a guest worker program or amnesty encourages more to come here illegally in hope of getting in on it.

    Amnesties and guest worker programs have been proven not to work. You come up with something.

  9. #9
    [quote:Aliba]You're talking as if ALL illegal aliens are Mexican, another form of sophistry.
    [/quote]

    Nope!
    I never said such thing. Why are you distorting what I have just wrote?

    Everyone can clearly see what I actually wrote:
    [quote:ImmortalE]"At least those who risked their lives to come here from Mexico.."[/quote]

    Where did you see me writing "ALL illegal aliens are Mexican"?
    Please answer.


    Next:
    I don't think Illegals are more AFRAID of being deported than any driver of getting into bad accident in rainy night on a highway, with poor visibility of road.
    As a matter of human nature, you can frighten someone only once, but gradually they get used to idea that "FATE WILL DECIDE ALL", and they simply resign to it, but they have no intentions to advance your agenda, wich is to permanently remove them all.
    Just as most drivers under adverse driving conditions won't stop driving nor would they voluntarily steer the car towards the concrete wall.

    Again, certain individual illegal immigrants may very well meet your expectations, especially those coming from "softer, comfortable, formerly middle class" backgrounds in Eastern Europe or else, but in no way a man who saw starvation, ruthless government and desperation of the kind that exists in Mexico will be frightened by those sanctionsd that you are talking about: he will simply laugh it off as foolish child games compared to what he had to face back home.


    I do not think you have a clear picture of how complex the problem of Illegal Immigration is.
    Thus your suggestions are too far from having a prospect of sustaining the ultimate test of reality.

    May God bless you!

  10. #10
    Aliba:

    I've read your questions.

    I will try to answer them, though at some later time.

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