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Thread: Psychophysiological detection of deception,

  1. #1
    I promised to avoid further postings on this site.
    But the presumptive naivette of some "scientific" fellows on this board just begs for little education and some advice.
    Below is summary of very important research.
    Wish you best of the luck.
    Let me know if you need my consulting services.

    DOI 10.1111/j.1469-8986.2004.00158.x

    Psychophysiological detection of deception, p300, Event-related potentials, Guilty knowledge tests, Lie detection

    JPeter Rosenfeld, Matthew Soskins, Gregory Bosh
    Department of Psychology, Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois, USA
    Andrew Ryan
    Department of Defense Polygraph Institute, Charleston, South Carolina, USA

    We found countermeasures to protocols using P300 in concealed information tests. One, the "six-probe" protocol, in Experiment 1, uses six different crime details in one run. The countermeasure: generate covert responses to irrelevant stimuli for each probe category. Hit rates were 82% in the guilty group; 18% in the countermeasure group. The average reaction time (RT) distinguished these two groups, but with overlap in RT distributions. The "one-probe" protocol, in the second experiment, uses one crime detail as a probe. Here, one group was run in 3 weeks as a guilty group, a countermeasure group, and again as in Week 1. Countermeasure: Covert responses to irrelevant stimuli. In Week 1, hit rate was 92%. In Week 2, it was 50%. In Week 3, 58%. There was no overlap in the irrelevant RT distribution in Week 2: Countermeasure use was detectable. However, in Week 3, the RT distributions resembled those of Week 1; test-beaters could not be caught. These studies have shown that tests of deception detection based on P300 amplitude as a recognition index may be readily defeated with simple countermeasures that can be easily learned.

  2. #2
    I promised to avoid further postings on this site.
    But the presumptive naivette of some "scientific" fellows on this board just begs for little education and some advice.
    Below is summary of very important research.
    Wish you best of the luck.
    Let me know if you need my consulting services.

    DOI 10.1111/j.1469-8986.2004.00158.x

    Psychophysiological detection of deception, p300, Event-related potentials, Guilty knowledge tests, Lie detection

    JPeter Rosenfeld, Matthew Soskins, Gregory Bosh
    Department of Psychology, Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois, USA
    Andrew Ryan
    Department of Defense Polygraph Institute, Charleston, South Carolina, USA

    We found countermeasures to protocols using P300 in concealed information tests. One, the "six-probe" protocol, in Experiment 1, uses six different crime details in one run. The countermeasure: generate covert responses to irrelevant stimuli for each probe category. Hit rates were 82% in the guilty group; 18% in the countermeasure group. The average reaction time (RT) distinguished these two groups, but with overlap in RT distributions. The "one-probe" protocol, in the second experiment, uses one crime detail as a probe. Here, one group was run in 3 weeks as a guilty group, a countermeasure group, and again as in Week 1. Countermeasure: Covert responses to irrelevant stimuli. In Week 1, hit rate was 92%. In Week 2, it was 50%. In Week 3, 58%. There was no overlap in the irrelevant RT distribution in Week 2: Countermeasure use was detectable. However, in Week 3, the RT distributions resembled those of Week 1; test-beaters could not be caught. These studies have shown that tests of deception detection based on P300 amplitude as a recognition index may be readily defeated with simple countermeasures that can be easily learned.

  3. #3
    Hi E,

    How have you been? Glad to see your post.... Here is the link for that one ...

    http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/lin...d=cJEo6SvLqMca

    what kind of consulting services do you provide ? keep posting on this board ... I m glad u r back ... have a great day ... Pasha

  4. #4
    Hi. That is very very interesting, and since my field is psychology, I am afraid that I have to say that there are heaps of studies that indicate people are very poor at detecting deception.

    Also there are numerous different aspects to the detection of lies, such as who is telling the lie, who is listening, what the relationship between the two people are, what culture they are from, what happened earlier... etc.

    And if you look at things like eye witness testimony and lie detector tests they are often very questionable.

  5. #5
    Hey E.

    I knew you'd come back. However I was starting to get a little worried. Hope u r not faker E. The real E. would have at least put a wink or two in the post.

    They all come back.


    ok people..... Pay up.

  6. #6
    E. It is good to see you back with thought provoking posts.


    4wow, I don't owe ya a dime! I did know something was missing and couldn't put my finger on it, it's the WINK! Now you and I are person #2 in his second posting.

  7. #7
    Still


    thats right. the wager was a fin. no coins please.

  8. #8
    P:
    what kind of consulting services do you provide ?

    E:
    Many different kinds ;-)
    ========================

    Q: Do you know why a child learns a language and thousands of other things at the speed that almost no adult can match?
    A: It is because the child has no preconceptions, his brain is like an open gate and he absorbs everything "as is".

    Later we spend in average 16-18 years to part with that natural, born ability to absorb and grasp the information the way we did during the first years of our life.

    Our heads get too much clogged with Sophistry and Dogmas while our comprehension and ability to see things clEarly suffers.

    If you know how to use your brain as it was meant to be used, there is very little you won't be able to comprehend.
    ==========================================

    As to the subject of "detection of deception", I usually succeed in getting all the information I need and to make a proper evaluation without ever asking a direct question.
    The tests are successful only if you are dealing with sufficiently stupid person.
    Otherwise, they fail.

    Now, I rarely assume that someone is sufficiently stupid.
    So, rather than ASKING someone something that I KNOW he/she CAN conceal, I instead focus in finding a pattern of thought/emotions that motivate/drive that person.

    The latter(pattern of thought/emotions) are constantly and unintentionally revealed in the course of casual conversation as well as in simple daily interactions.

    Then,once the certain, unique pattern is recognized, the next step is to "IDENTIFY" with it-in another words you must really try to BE that person.

    I don't guarantee a 100% accuracy but I am sure it will give you much more accurate information about the subject of your interest than any other kind of "tests" that are always presumptive and lacking in flexibility of adjusting to every individual case as it might significantly differ from the general/average statistical results.

    This is a posting board, so I can't elaborate too long ( simply tired/no strong motivation).
    But if there was a genuine interest I would be more than glad to share in more details of what I am talking about.

    Good luck.

    [This message was edited by E. on March 07, 2004 at 10:40 PM.]

    [This message was edited by E. on March 07, 2004 at 11:04 PM.]

  9. #9
    4now,
    don't panic so quickly ;-)
    I will be gone again soon.
    You are the best example of how NOT to use the brains ;-)

    P.S. There you've got 2 winks. Y

    The truth is there is something to learn from everybody.
    And you are not an exception.

    Good luck,
    and take care.

    :-) <----no wink here

  10. #10
    Leaving so soon


    Question to the forum members:
    How familiar does that story sound to you?



    E. said: "I will be gone again soon"

    Hmmmm...
    At that point first man gasps with the thought: "What an incomprehensible Swine!".
    He then abruptly ends the conversation and walks away at fast pace without saying any more word.

    At this very moment a delightful smile appears on the face of the second man. ;-)

    Two men part, never able to continue a conversation.
    ============================================

    Tsk Tsk E. Personal attacks/casting aspersions will not have much merit here

    E. said to 4now: You are the best example of how NOT to use the brains ;-)

    Hmmm...
    "Second, unable to grasp and frightened by the depth of subject, feels the need to stop the conversation and punish the One who perpetrated idyllic, peaceful state of his presumptive mind."


    E. said to 4now:
    "The truth is there is something to learn from everybody.And you are not an exception."

    Hmmm...

    Shocked by irrelevance of the question to the subject matter discussed, first man refuses to answer the question.



    Dude/Dudette.. Get the chip off your shoulder. It's getting heavy and its clouding your perception of things. Better you fence with wit than just go run for cover each time. Lighten up.. you are missing out on all the fun around here. Like an airball going right over your head.

    P. S.
    And a hoity toity 2 2 U 2 mate.

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