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  • SOCRATES and IMMIGRATION :)

    I was reading "Works on Socrates" by Xenophon about the trial of Socrates.

    And I thought,this Athenian was a Great man!

    Not only did he refuse to beg jurors for mercy but "by exalting himself before the court, he brought ill-will upon himself and made his conviction by the jury more certain".

    If I became an Illegal Immigrant due to circumstances beyond my control,and if I had US Born Citizen Children and family here,and if there was no real hope of legalazing my presence here, I wouldn't wish for anything anymore than to seek DELIBERATELY for my apprehension and deportation, for that would be the only way to prove the superiority of Reason over Ignorance.
    Of Decency over Hyppocracy.

    Good luck to all

    _________________________________
    I enjoy how many of the readers get my points so well

  • #2
    I was reading "Works on Socrates" by Xenophon about the trial of Socrates.

    And I thought,this Athenian was a Great man!

    Not only did he refuse to beg jurors for mercy but "by exalting himself before the court, he brought ill-will upon himself and made his conviction by the jury more certain".

    If I became an Illegal Immigrant due to circumstances beyond my control,and if I had US Born Citizen Children and family here,and if there was no real hope of legalazing my presence here, I wouldn't wish for anything anymore than to seek DELIBERATELY for my apprehension and deportation, for that would be the only way to prove the superiority of Reason over Ignorance.
    Of Decency over Hyppocracy.

    Good luck to all

    _________________________________
    I enjoy how many of the readers get my points so well

    Comment


    • #3
      That was Socrates ...The Great Socrates ...and in this era we are just human ... people...with all kinda urges...no satisfaction...we want more and more.... if we all could become like him then there would be a peaceful world without world wars / nuclear weapon and other terrorist activities ...

      Comment


      • #4
        Pasha,

        It really fascinates me to think of foolishness of those eternally incapable of understanding Athenians who never realised how much DID Socrates seek, giude and control his own TRIAL and CONVICTION

        Perhaps, in their own little minds, they were taking all the credit for themselves

        Take care

        Comment


        • #5
          That was Socrates ...The Great Socrates ...and in this era we are just human ... people...with all kinda urges...no satisfaction...we want more and more.... if we all could become like him then there would be a peaceful world without world wars / nuclear weapon and other terrorist activities ...

          You have to love how you rationalize bad acts committed on other people ( with all kinda urges...no satisfaction...we want more and more...). as long as folks invade other countries , shove their agenda down others folks throats, there will be violence and deaths. But then we can always post on a board make yourselves fell better for the moment and block out the harm you cause to your follow human beings , because after all your more deserving then them , HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM Hypocrisy?????

          Comment


          • #6
            Glad to see you back acelaw... . Now this move will wake SKS up .... We have had enough discussion on your idiotic question in past so just revise that material .... Though I m glad you changed your pattern of replies and didn't come up with 10,000 lines irrelavent copy and paste article ...got to go now...will catch ya later...have a great day...

            Comment


            • #7
              YOU, Acelaw, talk bout HIPOCRACY?

              I could only tell you, (You = Acelaw = Defender of LAWS and upholder of LAW ), that as long as US Constitution exists, as long as it is not a CRIME OF FELONY to defend HUMAN rights and dignity, I will keep expressing my opinion on the Immigration issues.

              It is not about "I, ME, MY personal background, ME being a LIAR or not" and all that b/s crap that you love to twist any posting into.
              Rather it is about ISSUES that EXIST outside of our INDIVIDUAL, PERSONAL realms, regardless of WHO we are and WHERE we stand.

              I have been calling for moderation and mutual understanding in resolving these issues and some EXTREMISTS apparently are NOT happy about that. I can see it.

              Very well then.
              I am sure you will live to see who IS the real HYPPOCRAT

              Comment


              • #8
                lets talk about the reality and real solution ....

                Comment


                • #9
                  Dilemma of Socrates had one solution:
                  Seek the TRIAL and through the PUBLIC TRIAL shame his Jurors in the eyes of ETERNITY, while earning himself a Glory of truly Reasonable, Highly MORAL man, whose brilliance of logic didn't give a way even in the worst of imaginable sircumstances.

                  You say fantasy?
                  Well,in the very last analysis ISN'T our whole life a kind of a fantasy, an illusion that holds its sway in our so called conscious and subconscious minds?
                  And if it is so, then isn't it preferable to live the best of all possible "fantasies"?

                  You are free to disagree, of course

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Please visit this wbsite and tell others about it:

                    http://www.geocities.com/morenos15/newproject04.html

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      hi E,

                      I didn't say fantasy ... I said talk abt reality .... That was Great Socrates ...
                      Glory of truly Reasonable, Highly MORAL man, whose brilliance of logic didn't give a way even in the worst of imaginable sircumstances.

                      Where r u going to find illegal with this kinda thinking in 21st century ? god speed !!! if we can find at least 1 out of 12 million .... So it wont work .... And that's why I told " talk abt reality / real circumstances of this era and some real solution ....

                      Didn't mean to put u down at all

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Socrates is m favorite philosopher. But remember that he didnt write anything, all his experiences were writen by Plato, his disciple.

                        I also love Wittgenstein (analysis of the language) and Rene Decart (i think, ergo I exist). The only thing this guys have in common is their ncredible intelligence. They were able to think (question) things no one had question before. Reading Philophy is like watching a good movie you dont know how it will end. It feels like your eyes are open for the first time and you are seen something you never saw before.

                        In my high school, I had to take a semester of Philosophy (it is mandatory for everyone). In college, al Libera Arts students had to take Philosophy 1 and Philosophy 2 (requirement to graduate). I took Philosophy 3 as an elective. This all happened abroad, in a poor little thrid-world country.

                        Do US students have to take Philosophy? It should be mandatory, is as important as Language or Math.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I was posting to Pashas comments so I don't know how you took that as directed to you . I do not recall calling you any of those things, I love the Human Rights you throw around , it seems every one has them except those that live in the USA legally , you might want to read what human rights are as defined by United Nations (http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/a_ccpr.htm) !!!!Mine are violated by those here illegally but that seems to be OK when it works in their favor.
                          Article 12 #HYPERLINK "/tbs/doc.nsf/(symbol)/CCPR.C.21.Rev.1.Add.9,+CCPR+General+comment+27.En?OpenDocument"General comment on its implementation
                          1. Everyone lawfully within the territory of a State shall, within that territory, have the right to liberty of movement and freedom to choose his residence.
                          2. Everyone shall be free to leave any country, including his own.
                          3. The above-mentioned rights shall not be subject to any restrictions except those which are provided by law, are necessary to protect national security, public order (ordre public), public health or morals or the rights and freedoms of others, and are consistent with the other rights recognized in the present Covenant.
                          4. No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of the right to enter his own country.
                          Article 13
                          An alien lawfully in the territory of a State Party to the present Covenant may be expelled therefrom only in pursuance of a decision reached in accordance with law and shall, except where compelling reasons of national security otherwise require, be allowed to submit the reasons against his expulsion and to have his case reviewed by, and be represented for the purpose before, the competent authority or a person or persons especially designated by the competent authority.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            E

                            Originally posted by acelaw:
                            I was posting to Pashas comments so I don't know how you took that as directed to you . I do not recall calling you any of those things, I love the Human Rights you throw around , it seems every one has them except those that live in the USA legally , you might want to read what human rights are as defined by United Nations (http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/a_ccpr.htm) !!!!Mine are violated by those here illegally but that seems to be OK when it works in their favor.

                            Article 12 #HYPERLINK "/tbs/doc.nsf/(symbol)/CCPR.C.21.Rev.1.Add.9,+CCPR+General+comment+27.En?OpenDocument"General comment on its implementation
                            1. Everyone lawfully within the territory of a State shall, within that territory, have the right to liberty of movement and freedom to choose his residence.
                            2. Everyone shall be free to leave any country, including his own.
                            3. The above-mentioned rights shall not be subject to any restrictions except those which are provided by law, are necessary to protect national security, public order (ordre public), public health or morals or the rights and freedoms of others, and are consistent with the other rights recognized in the present Covenant.
                            4. No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of the right to enter his own country.
                            Article 13
                            An alien lawfully in the territory of a State Party to the present Covenant may be expelled therefrom only in pursuance of a decision reached in accordance with law and shall, except where compelling reasons of national security otherwise require, be allowed to submit the reasons against his expulsion and to have his case reviewed by, and be represented for the purpose before, the competent authority or a person or persons especially designated by the competent authority.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              AceIaw:

                              Never did I say that you have no rights, nor did I claim that Illegals should have more rights than Legal Residents.
                              What an absurd that would be!

                              But I say: 1. Define Policy towards Immigration.
                              2. Implement it desisively and plausibly. 3. Respect the Human Rights of people, regardless of Race and Immigration status.

                              Apparently, some people see contradiction here when I say: deport them but be Humane.
                              Perhaps, some people make an equation between
                              DEPORT=hate them=kick their ***=degrade and insult them=post all the trash about them, while the word HUMANE associates with USC Passport=$10000/month welfare=make them a Master race=let them do as they wish=let them hate America and glorify Aztec and etc.

                              Well, these are very faulty equations, to say at least.
                              And ones that help no one, but make things worse for everyone.

                              Anyway, if you have read my postings in the past you already know what my points are.

                              Good luck.

                              Comment

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