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  • Nun Pro Tunc

    Okay ... I spoke to someone at the Embassy in Panama, who said that immigration officers at the airport have the ability to backdate the Advance Parole on the spot to the date that the person left, which is called "nun pro tunc." This does not always happen, of course, but it was suggested that the chances of this would be good if my wife has her advance parole when she comes back as well as a doctor's note saying that her grandfather was sick. I think I will also fly down and fly back with her to try to explain to the immigration officers what has happened.

    Obviously, I would have never allowed her to go if I knew she needed to have advance parole before leaving. My lawyer, a really bad one I've since discovered, said I could mail her the parole and it would not be a problem. I've since found out it IS a problem, but one I hope I can remedy. Ignorance of the law is no excuse, I know many of you will say, but in the case of Immigration Law - which I'm finding out is so complex that you can't even trust lawyers to understand it - there needs to be some sort of leeway and compassion. I'm hoping the folks at the airport will understand this.

    The person at the Panamanian Embassy also said they could "parole her in" - which would let her come in the country, but we'd have to refile everything. I have no problem with that. I'd be happy to do it. I just want my wife back with me, and she wants the same.

    I think I'll also try contacting my local congressman and perhaps he can write a letter for us to show at the airport explaining the situation. I don't know if that will help, but maybe.

    And if the Constitution DOESN'T give us the right to marry who we want, it should. That document was written in the 1700s and we now have a much more globalized world. People travel as a matter of business and life, and yes, maybe it's hard for some people to believe, but some of those people do fall in love. Those people have the right to be together ... and if it's not in the constitution, it should be. I don't believe in illegal immigration or letting anyone come here who **** well wants to, but a person such as myself, who works hard, obeys the law and a person such as my wife, who was HERE LEGALLY when we married and who also is educated and a good person ... well, the United States needs to use some common sense. And I'm hoping they will do so when my wife tries re-entering the country. I just hope the Advance Parole we filed is indeed granted and it works. Otherwise, I'd have to get her a K3 Visa, which would take almost a year.

    I'm not sure if anyone has had any experience with this "Nun pro tunc" law or how often it is granted. I'd be interested to know any more about it.

  • #2
    Okay ... I spoke to someone at the Embassy in Panama, who said that immigration officers at the airport have the ability to backdate the Advance Parole on the spot to the date that the person left, which is called "nun pro tunc." This does not always happen, of course, but it was suggested that the chances of this would be good if my wife has her advance parole when she comes back as well as a doctor's note saying that her grandfather was sick. I think I will also fly down and fly back with her to try to explain to the immigration officers what has happened.

    Obviously, I would have never allowed her to go if I knew she needed to have advance parole before leaving. My lawyer, a really bad one I've since discovered, said I could mail her the parole and it would not be a problem. I've since found out it IS a problem, but one I hope I can remedy. Ignorance of the law is no excuse, I know many of you will say, but in the case of Immigration Law - which I'm finding out is so complex that you can't even trust lawyers to understand it - there needs to be some sort of leeway and compassion. I'm hoping the folks at the airport will understand this.

    The person at the Panamanian Embassy also said they could "parole her in" - which would let her come in the country, but we'd have to refile everything. I have no problem with that. I'd be happy to do it. I just want my wife back with me, and she wants the same.

    I think I'll also try contacting my local congressman and perhaps he can write a letter for us to show at the airport explaining the situation. I don't know if that will help, but maybe.

    And if the Constitution DOESN'T give us the right to marry who we want, it should. That document was written in the 1700s and we now have a much more globalized world. People travel as a matter of business and life, and yes, maybe it's hard for some people to believe, but some of those people do fall in love. Those people have the right to be together ... and if it's not in the constitution, it should be. I don't believe in illegal immigration or letting anyone come here who **** well wants to, but a person such as myself, who works hard, obeys the law and a person such as my wife, who was HERE LEGALLY when we married and who also is educated and a good person ... well, the United States needs to use some common sense. And I'm hoping they will do so when my wife tries re-entering the country. I just hope the Advance Parole we filed is indeed granted and it works. Otherwise, I'd have to get her a K3 Visa, which would take almost a year.

    I'm not sure if anyone has had any experience with this "Nun pro tunc" law or how often it is granted. I'd be interested to know any more about it.

    Comment


    • #3
      The Constitution does NOT restrict the right of persons to marry or otherwise associate themselves with others for lawful purposes. Further, federal law does protects families to some extent. The problem is that immigration law was designed a long, long time ago and has been butchered, misread and abused resulting in tough provisions for enforcement without the necessary counterparts for family unification. Immigration law has grown and evolved to adapt to political events and other economic issues however, families are being neglected when it comes to reform and change. I often mention TPS and Cuban adjustment as clear examples of nonsense. Your wife has to undergo a background check as part of the adjustment of status process to detect criminal activity, further, when your wife enters the U.S. she'll be subject to a check to detect possible admissibility issues before she is paroled.. and she is coming to be with you. However, a Cuban citizen -WILL- be granted AOS as a matter of law because of political considerations while your WIFE "COULD" be granted AOS as a matter of DISCRETION. However, there's no way to know anything about Cuban citizens through background checks and Mr. Castro has stated several times that he's clearing the jails out of criminals sending them to the U.S. How is heaven's name is that fair? People talk and talk and talk some more about amnesty, but amnesty is present here today taking good care individuals who never bothered to get a visa, individuals with no ties to the U.S., individuals who never even bother to learn the language. Congress should consider american families FIRST when it comes to immigration. A U.S. Citizen should not have to be subject to the "discretion" of an individual in order to keep his or her family together while a foreigner is granted a benefit as a matter of law just because he happens to be from a country that is HOSTILE to the U.S.... Where is the "fundamental fairness" of the law here?

      Comment


      • #4
        Tap - that's a good lead. How about running that scenario by IO in charge at the Port of Entry, where your wife will most likely enter the US?

        Comment


        • #5
          Thank you Aneri. That is a good idea. I will try contacting the immigration officer in charge at the airport. I just find it very frustrating that I listened to the bad advice of a lawyer and when I pay for a consultation from another lawyer, they all have different things to say and I find out through my own research what may be the best course of action. Isn't there a lawyer out there who has dealt with this and successfully worked with immigration authorities at airports to ensure that the spouse of a U.S. citizen is granted this discretion and allowed in? She's gotten her fingerprints done, do a background check, do whatever you need to do to see that she isn't a terrorist or something, research me ... you know? And send me the bill. It's just absolutely ridiculous that no one seems to know how to handle something like this, which I'm sure must happen to more people than just me, especially considering the fact that my imbecile lawyer told me I could mail her the advance parole overseas in the first place. Sorry ... I just am upset. But hopefully I can resolve this myself - or perhaps my congressman can help me.

          Comment


          • #6
            Good Luck Tap. Let us know the outcome of your case.

            Newly

            Comment


            • #7
              In general nunc pro tunc (Latin meaning "now for then") involves retroactivly changing the timing of an event to an earlier date. It applies to orders, judgments or the filing of documents. Retroactive dating requires a court order which can be obtained by a showing that the earlier date would have been legal, and there was error, accidental omission or neglect which has caused a problem or inconvenience which can be cured.


              Although it doesn't relate to Advance Parole, here is an excerpt from www.Murthy.com that explains a little about the process and potential success of a Nunc Pro Tunc request.

              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Although the INS regulations provide that an individual must be in status at the time of filing a request to extend status, the INS will sometimes approve an H-4 or other dependent status extension "nunc pro tunc" or backdated to the date it should have been filed. Whether to allow this is entirely discretionary on the part of INS and there are significant risks to filing such requests. Nunc pro tunc extensions should be used only when a mistake has occurred, but there are no guarantees of success. The INS must be convinced that the mistake was through no fault of the foreign national. Not knowing the law is usually never, in and of itself, sufficient reason to obtain a discretionary approval from the INS. One should always pay attention to status expiration dates and to the importance of maintaining status.

              TSC has indicated that it will review the facts of each such case and consider a request for Nunc Pro Tunc processing, provided the request is placed on a colored sheet of paper and labeled "Nunc Pro Tunc Request." </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

              How this is handled with POE and immigration, I can't say.
              The above is simply an opinion. Your mileage may vary. For immigration issues, please consult an immigration attorney.

              Comment


              • #8
                Sappy - thanks for the response.

                The very frustrating thing about all this, I am discovering, is that immigration law is so complex that different people tell you different things. And there are rules on the books that aren't strictly followed. I called the airport where my wife will be returning, and someone in customs there told me as long as she has her advance parole, that she will most likely be allowed into the country, even if she left before she had it in hand. She said she just had to file before leaving. Now, this is not what the law says ... but it seems that this is not unheard of and is a rule not strictly enforced. I am still very upset at my previous attorney for not telling me all the facts, but I think I am even more upset at the United States of America for having such cloudy rules. Let me just say this ... the people who WANT TO LEAVE THIS COUNTRY for the most part are the people who have perfectly good intents about being here. They are the people who have families overseas that they care about and wish to see, business ventures, loose ends to tie up at home, etc. It's the illegal immigrants, criminals, etc. who DON't WANT TO LEAVE. The laws here are ridiculous. Why should someone need some sort of life-and-death reason to visit their family overseas if they are married to a U.S. citizen? You should not have to go through all this and stop your life and be punished just because you happened to fall in love with an American. It's really, really sad. And as a well-educated American, I do not quite understand it.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Idon't know who gave you this Idea that Nunc pro tunc can be done by immigration officer. Advance paroleed alien can go out from US and paroled back in. Nunc pro tunc motion can be filed in court and if granted then alien position can be reverted back to the place where he was "then" if there is any error in proceedings..
                  good luck.
                  Its a discussion, not a legal advise..

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