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What is right with Islam

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  • What is right with Islam

    For some time now I thought that most of the people are against Islam because we don't know much about it.

    Seriously, what do we now about it?

    This is a very good clip
    “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

  • #2
    For some time now I thought that most of the people are against Islam because we don't know much about it.

    Seriously, what do we now about it?

    This is a very good clip
    “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

    Comment


    • #3
      I am against it because I know more than you about it.

      Like Islam started out and remains a violent religious-political movement founded in war and continuing to war on all those who are not Muslims.

      House of Peace, House of War

      Islam means submission.

      The question is, will you submit?

      Comment


      • #4
        The body count for this year's Ramadan.

        So, how many bodies before we learn that there is alot wrong with Islam?

        Comment


        • #5
          Wasn't it you on here stating that people who don't know history will repeat it?

          http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirty_Years%27_War
          “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

          Comment


          • #6
            Talking of history repeating itself, nearly 30 years of violence ended in Northern Ireland when both sides agreed to recognize each other. All the "fight into infinity" approach on both sides did was to prolong the inevitable killing thousands on both sides in the process. Eventually even the most hardened of terrorists (extremists) grew tired of their old ways because they found it wasn't working anymore and they witnessed loosing too many of their friends as well. However just a war seems, only a fool would continue to "fight into infinity" or as Rumsfeld kept saying "stay the course".

            The Troubles
            "What you see in the photograph isn't what you saw at the time. The real skill of photography is organized visual lying."

            Comment


            • #7
              How long ago was the 30 Years War?

              My stats were for this year's Ramadan. And did not include other Muslim terrorism for the year, decade, or century.

              Comment


              • #8
                And don't forget who started the conflict in the first place. Muslims rolled out of Arabia, slaughtering, terrorizing and conquering.

                Comment


                • #9
                  For this discussion it doesn't matter when it happened, it matters that it happened. You think that only Muslims are violent for their faith and within the various branches of their religion. That is not so, and that's why I brought up the example of the 30 year war and Brit rightfully brought up the conflict with Northern Ireland.

                  The protestant vs. catholic conflict in the 17th century as well as the more recent IRA-conflict had nothing to do with Muslims (Arabs) at all.

                  Those were Christian conflicts! So, don't tell me that only Muslims are violent.

                  Furthermore, on my way to work I was thinking about what's going on here in America, specifically New York (the mosque issue). Trump is now suggesting they move the mosque to some other place. Overall, he is suggesting this to keep the peace. I don't think the mosque should be moved. While I don't condone Trump's idea, it stems from an emotion. The conflict arose due to emotions (i.e., people who lost loved ones in the 9/11 attack). We all have emotions, everybody has their own emotions about various issues. One cannot run a country on emotions. Impossible!

                  This is America, her constitution (a most wonderfully written law book) dictates separation from church and state. We'll all be better off if we just stick to the book.
                  “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    KollerKraut says: WE don't know much about islam...better speak for yourself, like in fist person singular.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NO AMNESTY!!!:
                      KollerKraut says: WE don't know much about islam...better speak for yourself, like in fist person singular. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      The reason why I choose "we" (first person plural)...I have a sense of comradery you on the other hand are an egocentric fool.
                      “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Excellent post Koller and I agree, there's too much emotion driving the issues today. Just like the Tea Partiers who thrive on empty headed slogans via Rush, Beck and Palin.

                        Where is the rational thought? Where are the real Statesman we need to guide us through these difficult times? I shudder to think what will happen if a Palin/Bachmann ticket wins in 2012. It'll make the Bush years look like the Wise Elder in the village instead of the village idiot.
                        "What you see in the photograph isn't what you saw at the time. The real skill of photography is organized visual lying."

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Brit4064:
                          Excellent post Koller and I agree, there's too much emotion driving the issues today. Just like the Tea Partiers who thrive on empty headed slogans via Rush, Beck and Palin.

                          Where is the rational thought? Where are the real Statesman we need to guide us through these difficult times? I shudder to think what will happen if a Palin/Bachmann ticket wins in 2012. It'll make the Bush years look like the Wise Elder in the village instead of the village idiot. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                          The real statesmen - you ask? The ones that perceive themselves as such, are all hovering like vultures over the graveside of 3000 people trying to gain a vote or two.

                          Disgusting!
                          “...I may condemn what you say, but I will give my life for that you may say it”! - Voltaire

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
                            The real statesmen - you ask? The ones that perceive themselves as such, are all hovering like vultures over the graveside of 3000 people trying to gain a vote or two.

                            Disgusting! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                            True and the likes of fedNUT and No Brain lap it up and go vote for them.
                            "What you see in the photograph isn't what you saw at the time. The real skill of photography is organized visual lying."

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              source

                              French Senate passes ban on burqas


                              The French Senate on Tuesday overwhelmingly passed a bill banning the burqa-style Islamic veil on public streets and other places, a measure that affects less than 2,000 women but that has been widely seen as a symbolic defense of French values.

                              The Senate voted 246 to 1 in favor of the bill in a final step toward making the ban a law - though it now must pass muster with France's constitutional watchdog. The bill was overwhelmingly passed in July in the lower house, the National Assembly.

                              Many Muslims believe the legislation is one more blow to France's No. 2 religion, and risks raising the level of Islamophobia in a country where mosques, like synagogues, are sporadic targets of hate. However, the law's many proponents say it will preserve the nation's values, including its secular foundations and a notion of fraternity that is contrary to those who hide their faces.

                              In an attempt to head off any legal challenges over arguments it tramples on religious and other freedoms, the leaders of both parliamentary houses said they had asked a special body to ensure it passes constitutional muster. The Constitutional Council has one month to rule.

                              The bill is worded to trip safely through legal minefields. For instance, the words "women," "Muslim" and "veil" are not even mentioned in any of its seven articles.





                              "This law was the object of long and complex debates," the Senate president, Gerard Larcher, and National Assembly head Bernard Accoyer said in a joint statement announcing their move. They said they want to be certain there is "no uncertainty" about its conforming to the constitution.

                              France would be the first European country to pass such a law, though others, notably neighboring Belgium, are considering laws against face-covering veils, seen as conflicting with the local culture.

                              "Our duty concerning such fundamental principles of our society is to speak with one voice," said Justice Minister Michele Alliot-Marie, opening a less than 5-hour-long debate ahead of the vote.

                              The measure, carried by President Nicolas Sarkozy's conservative party, was passed by the lower house of parliament, the National Assembly, on July 13.

                              It would outlaw face-covering veils, including those worn by tourists from the Middle East, on public streets and elsewhere. The bill set fines of 150 ($185) or citizenship classes for any woman caught covering her face, or both. It also carries stiff penalties for anyone, such as husbands or brothers, convicted of forcing the veil on a woman. The 30,000 ($38,400) fine and year in prison are doubled if the victim is a minor.

                              The bill is aimed at ensuring gender equality, women's dignity and security, as well as upholding France's secular values - and its way of life.

                              Some women, like Kenza Drider, have vowed to wear a full-face veil despite a law. Drider says she prefers to flirt with arrest rather than bow to what she says is an injustice.

                              "It is a law that is unlawful," said Drider, a mother of four from Avignon, in southern France. "It is ... against individual liberty, freedom of religion, liberty of conscience," she said.

                              "I will continue to live my life as I always have with my full veil," she told Associated Press Television News.

                              Drider was the only woman who wears a full-faced veil to be interviewed by a parliamentary panel that spent six months deciding whether to move ahead with legislation.

                              Muslim leaders concur that Islam does not require a woman to hide her face. However, they have voiced concerns that a law forbidding them to do so would stigmatize the French Muslim population, which at an estimated 5 million is the largest in western Europe. Numerous Muslim women who wear the face-covering veil have said they are being increasingly harassed in the streets.

                              However, the bill has its Muslim defenders, like a women's rights group active in heavily immigrant neighborhoods.

                              "How can we allow the burqa here and at the same time fight the Taliban and all the fundamentalist groups across the world?" said the president of NPNS, Sihem Habchi. "I'm Muslim and I can't accept that because I'm a woman I have to disappear," she told APTN.

                              Raphael Liogier, a sociology professor who heads the Observatory of the Religious in Aix-en-Provence, says that Muslims in France are already targeted by hate-mongers and the ban on face-covering veils "will officialize Islamophobia."

                              "With the identity crisis that France has today, the scapegoat is the Muslim," he told The Associated Press.

                              Indeed, the justice minister said that the French "ask about the future of their society, of their nation" as they "see the internationalization of our society."

                              "The Senate must guarantee the permanence of our values ... which forge our identity," she said.

                              Ironically, instead of helping some women integrate, the measure may keep them cloistered in their homes to avoid exposing their faces in public.

                              "I won't go out. I'll send people to shop for me. I'll stay home, very simply," said Oum Al Khyr, who wears a "niqab" that hides all but the eyes.

                              "I'll spend my time praying," said the single woman "over age 45" who lives in Montreuil on Paris' eastern edge. "I'll exclude myself from society when I wanted to live in it."

                              The law banning the veil would take effect only after a six-month period designed to convince women to show their faces.

                              The Interior Ministry estimates the number of women who fully cover themselves at some 1,900, with a quarter of them converts to Islam and two-thirds with French nationality.

                              The French parliament wasted no time in working to get a ban in place, opening an inquiry shortly after the French president said in June 2009 that full veils that hide the face are "not welcome" in France.

                              It was unclear, however, how police would enforce the law, from handing out fines to hunting down any men who might force the veil on their wives and daughters.

                              "I will accept the fine with great pleasure," said Drider, vowing to appeal to the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg if she gets caught.

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