quote:

Originally posted by UnitedStatesDude:

quote:

Originally posted by marmaduk:

quote:

We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this excludes the red flag, which symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it excludes any foreign flag

Then would you care to explain why the predominant display of Mexico's flag on those pro-illegal ralies?

They didnt know any better!

As far as better answering marmaduk's question -neither do you! Should search for information first.

quote:

Originally posted by blondag2:
ivees 27, why doesn't the word "ILLEGAL" mean anything to you ?? But then again, you probably speed in your car, leave the scene of an accident, and holdup liquor stores too, even though all these things are "ILLEGAL". I am a naturalized
American Citizen,and it took me 5 yrs to be one...It has also taken me over one year to bring my fiancee here to be married. Why should ANYONE be allowed to just walk into this great country,and live off what others have sweatted and died for ? LET THEM ALL APPLY PROPERLY ! ! ! ! ! !

It is ridiculous to compare someone who is hungry & just wants to work and feed their family to a criminal like burglars,murderers,rapists,drunk drivers etc...

I'm sorry I have a heart, that i watch these documentaries on people coming from conditions that are beyond the definition of poverty, inhumane conditions (most caused by hurricanes like Katrina and earthquakes), with starving & sick children in Central America. AND they don't "just walk in " Women have to leave their babies behind(starving), walk hundreds of miles, get gang raped, risk their lives jumping the train of death, be robbed and beaten by gangs & police, risk their lives walking in desert heat over 100 degrees and after a month to two months of this hell we can't even imagine, by the grace of God they make it to the U.S, I say they paid their dues and God allowed them make it...Yes, I vote they stay and if I could let them all come to my house to help everybody stay off their backs then I would. I can't watch people go through these unimaginable things and wish them sent back. I just can't AND I will fight till the day I die to help people try to understand.

And you can throw as many stones at me as you please, God will judge me!!!

www.myfreeusa.com

sorry dufus, but the US of A cannot take in every single person on the planet that is having a tough time....but you are too stupid to understand this.
You post brave words..."if I could let them all come to my house.."--- come on...get yourself on the local news....go down to the local 7-11 one morning and pickup merely a dozen illegals, take them to your home, let them live there rent-free, let them use your car, your daughter, anything and everything you own....let's see how brave you really are when you actually have to do something visible....but you are just a hypocritical moron who will not take in a single illegal....it is not the fault of any American citizen if there is a hurricane, tornado, earthquake,etc....when Katrina hit, how many Mexicans/Polish/Ukranians opened up their homes, their countries, their wallets and helped out displaced American citizens? Answer:0. So, why does American owe the whole world a high standard of living, placed on the backs of hard working American taxpayers? Explain this, if you can. But you can't. You'll just try to avoid answering any difficult questions or challenges..because no illegal alien supporter has one shred of logical reasoning behind their misplaced and myopic viewpoint. What a wimp you are.

quote:

Originally posted by Someone12:
sorry dufus, but the US of A cannot take in every single person on the planet that is having a tough time....but you are too stupid to understand this.
You post brave words..."if I could let them all come to my house.."--- come on...get yourself on the local news....go down to the local 7-11 one morning and pickup merely a dozen illegals, take them to your home, let them live there rent-free, let them use your car, your daughter, anything and everything you own....let's see how brave you really are when you actually have to do something visible....but you are just a hypocritical moron who will not take in a single illegal....it is not the fault of any American citizen if there is a hurricane, tornado, earthquake,etc....when Katrina hit, how many Mexicans/Polish/Ukranians opened up their homes, their countries, their wallets and helped out displaced American citizens? Answer:0. So, why does American owe the whole world a high standard of living, placed on the backs of hard working American taxpayers? Explain this, if you can. But you can't. You'll just try to avoid answering any difficult questions or challenges..because no illegal alien supporter has one shred of logical reasoning behind their misplaced and myopic viewpoint. What a wimp you are.

I haven't heard one intelligent thing come out of your filthy mouth yet...all the name calling doesn't do anything, you throw out fact less rubbish (how do you personally know who did or did not help Katrina victims?)You are a hateful, vengeful, worthless piece of flesh!
Ask me a difficult question big guy, come on, stop calling me names like a elementary school child and stop talking about "the f***ing Tax money" I already answered that!!! Ask me, you whiny a**...Have I seen you on the News lately, NOOOOOO...you sit at your computer screaming in forums...As for me I have been posting on any message board available, hundreds of hours of research & Investigation, I have created,Printed & put out flyer's in my city, I have emailed Congress, I have a petition to Congress and mark my words, I will be on the news one day, it is my goal...I am a 31 yr old single mother, so it is difficult to do all that i would like...whats your excuse??? Huh?...You are just a redneck hillbilly fat a*** sitting on a computer in a forum finding any thread to jump in and yell "DIRT BAG" too much of a P***y to show your face when you say that...You are so pathetic, you repeat yourself in every thread, nothing intelligent, nothing interesting, absolutely no imagination in your name calling. Get a life!!!

you are just a whining moron whose IQ would not warm water....no wonder you are a single mother....what fool would marry you? Who wants to be married to a whining idiot?
go ahead, open your trailer to a dozen illegals....
but as usual, like all moronic illegal alien supporters, when challenged to explain or defend your half-a$$ed position, you can't.
Explain where billions of people are going to live and work, idiot. No doubt you flunked out of high school (and you certainly were not a cheer leader...you probably can't jump 1" off the ground)...study economics someday (and have someone translate the big words for you)

quote:

....when Katrina hit, how many Mexicans/Polish/Ukranians opened up their homes, their countries, their wallets and helped out displaced American citizens? Answer:0. So,

You ignorant SON OF A B I T C H . Why don't you try to educate yourself a little before you post, you miserable loser?

"..On September 4 the Mexican Navy offered ships, buses and helicopters to assist in rescue missions. The offer was accepted and the Mexican ship Papaloapan departed from Tampico, with two Mi-17 helicopters, eight all-terrain vehicles, seven amphibious vehicles, two tankers, radio communication equipment, medical personnel and 250 tons of food..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_response_to_Hurricane_Katrina

ivees27:
OMG, you!!! You're also a woman? I had the impression all along that you're a man. I'm beginning to have a crush on you because of your decency and broad thinking . Anyway, please don't be enticed to go down the ballpark of obscenity, vulgarity and profanity where your clash with S12 is taking you; he's very good at it, you're not. Maintain your level-headed approach with innate kindness. This poster is a machine which is too surreal to be human, more like a byproduct of some techno-wizard which generates auto responses.

Ivees, Explora, Librada- you're all wonderful ladies.
My kudos to you all!
Great website Ivees- checked it out. Great job.

IP

Immigrants' advocates look to churches
The New Bedford Standard Times

Sen. Edward Kennedy, D-Mass., holds hands with grieving members of the immigrant community during a prayer March 11 at a Spanish Mass in New Bedford, Mass. U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents rounded up more than 350 factory workers March 6.

Cardinal Roger Mahony: Advocacy part of tradition.
Land: Nation has "mandate to act compassionately" toward "hard-working and other wise law-abiding immigrants."

By Kathy Kiely, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Over the past few weeks, Sen. Edward Kennedy, D-Mass., a staunch defender of abortion rights, has been receiving bouquets from some unexpected quarters as he works to overhaul the nation's immigration laws.
"All of us owe Sen. Kennedy a great debt of gratitude for his vision," Cardinal Roger Mahony of Los Angeles said after the two held a meeting on immigration legislation last month. Last week, at a news conference on the same subject, Kennedy and Richard Land of the Southern Baptist Convention, traded biblical quotations.

The two tableaus illustrate what advocates hope will be their secret weapon in a drive to win a path to citizenship for the nation's estimated 12 million illegal immigrants

As they return to their home states and districts this week, lawmakers may be receiving pastoral visits from local clerics — and not just to discuss the Passover and Easter holy days.

Religious leaders from a range of denominations are launching efforts to win passage of a bill that creates a path toward citizenship for the nation's illegal immigrants. That has put some of them at odds with traditional allies on other social issues, such as abortion and *** marriage.

FIND MORE STORIES IN: Republicans | Hispanic | Mass | Catholic Church | Roman Catholic | Sen. Edward Kennedy | Southern Baptist Convention | NEW BEDFORD | Mahony | Rep. Brian Bilbray | Richard Land
Samuel Rodriguez, president of the National Hispanic Christian Leadership Conference, said the nation's largest Hispanic evangelical organization will be trying to change the minds of 40 House Republicans "who traditionally depend on the evangelical vote."

Upcoming debate

Last year, it was Republican conservatives who blocked a House bill granting illegal immigrants a chance to stay in the USA after the Senate passed it. Now Democrats are in charge of both the House and Senate and preparing to take up the issue again.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., has reserved the last two weeks in May for an immigration debate. House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md., plans to take up in July immigration legislation introduced last month by Reps. Luis Gutierrez, D-Ill., and Jeff Flake, R-Ariz.

The legislation being pushed by Kennedy's bipartisan coalition in the Senate and Gutierrez and Flake in the House is designed to bring illegal immigrants now in the USA out of the shadows; beef up enforcement along the borders; make it harder for employers to hire illegal immigrants and increase opportunities for foreigners to work here legally.

It has drawn passionate opposition, running the gamut from labor unions that say the influx of foreign workers will undercut American standards of living to conservative Republicans who say illegal immigrants would be rewarded for breaking the law. The basic concepts in the legislation also have powerful advocates, including President Bush and the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.

When Gutierrez was asked to name who he's counting on most to help push his bill into law, he focused on another powerful grass-roots organization.

"The church," he said. "Last time I checked, most people do listen at their church or their synagogue or their mosque at least on a weekly basis. They're a powerful tool of persuasion."

Kennedy has organized several news conferences to showcase the ecumenical support for what he described as an issue of social justice. "This is a moral question, deeply moral," said Kennedy, a Roman Catholic. He quoted the New Testament book of Matthew, in which Jesus Christ suggests that his followers will be judged by "what did you do for the least of these?"

Land, the president of the Southern Baptist Convention's Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission, echoed Kennedy's views. He said the nation has "a biblical mandate to act compassionately" toward "hard-working and otherwise law-abiding immigrants." While they may have come here illegally, they have plenty of home-grown co-conspirators in the form of "employers who knowingly hire and exploit them," Land said.

Other religious conservatives are more nuanced in their statements on the immigration debate.

Sinful immigration

Christian Coalition Chairwoman Roberta Combs says on the group's website that it is a sin "to ignore or disrespect national boundaries." Jim Backlin, a lobbyist for the coalition, said most of the group's 2.5 million members support requiring illegal immigrants to leave the USA before applying for citizenship — a controversial proposal that would "likely bring hardship to many immigrant families and could potentially strand heads of households in distant countries," according to the Fair Immigration Reform Movement, an immigrant rights group.

Land acknowledged he may be "a little bit ahead" of the 16-million-member Southern Baptist Convention's rank and file.

For Catholic prelates, on the other hand, immigrant rights are a vital concern to a growing segment of the church. The 2001 American Religious Identification Survey suggested that the nation's fastest-growing minority (the 2000 Census said the USA was 12% Hispanic, up from 9% in 1990) was the main reason the numbers of Catholics held relatively steady while most major Protestant denominations lost membership.

Approximately 35% of the nation's 65 million Roman Catholics are Latino, according to the Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate, a Georgetown University group that studies the Roman Catholic Church.

Mahony sees the Catholic Church's lobbying effort as part of a long tradition. "Since 1770, the Catholic Church has helped every wave of immigrants" into the USA, he said.

Some Catholics disagree.

"I don't see the Holy See giving me directions on this issue," said Rep. Brian Bilbray. The California Republican, a Roman Catholic, heads the Immigration Reform Caucus, which opposes legalization for illegal immigrants.

In an allusion to the scandal over pedophile priests, Bilbray argued that "there's a lot of problems we have in the Catholic Church" because of a misguided emphasis on redemption.

"Nothing's more Christ-like than forgiving transgressors and always giving them a second chance," said Bilbray. "But when it comes to our national sovereignty, rewarding people for breaking the law is a sin in my opinion."

Contributing: Cathy Grossman

No matter how we slice it, no matter how you sugar coat it, no matter how the 'limousine liberal Kennedy' shoots his mouth, the fact is still the same, ILLEGALS ARE CRIMINALS. Why? because they don't respect our laws, they enter our country like THIEVES IN THE NIGHT, other come floating on tires like the Cubans, or Haitians, or Dominicans, and losers like these. Or, they come as "TOURISTS" with the intention of "overstaying" that is, being a **** illegal ab-using OUR SYSTEM. Right away the women get pregnant and start pushing puppies, that alone qualifies them to get OUR MEDICAL ATTENTION, OUR FOOD STAMPS, OUR SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS, OUR EDUCATION, and so on, and so on.

President Reagan established an AMNESTY in the 1980's TO END THE PROBLEM OF ILLEGALS. It did not work because we DON'T CLOSE OUR BORDERS, because WE EMPLOY THE ILLEGALS, because WE INSIST ON PATRONIZING STORES AND/OR PRODUCTS that the problem countries send over to us. Mexicans, Philipinos, Africans, Hindus, and so on, know that AMERICANS ARE WEAK, so they keep coming to my country because they know they will be taken care of and eventually some jackass will provide with yer ANOTHER amnesty.

But wait, there's more. These illegals have the "nerve" to bring their relatives, especially the old ones, like parents, aunts, uncles, the list is endless, who have NEVER WORKED A DAY IN THE US, who have never seen a doctor, dentist, optometrist, taken medicines, for whatever reasons in their own countries. But not to worry, these people go directly to our welfare offices and most importantly TO OUR SOCIAL SECURITY ADMIN. and because of their age they start collecting immediately monthly SOCIAL SECURITY CHECKS THAT BELONG TO AMERICANS or LEGAL RESIDENTS, plus Medicare, food stamps, etc. We need to write TODAY to our reps. and SOC SECURITY and tell them to stop this bull. Noone should be able to collect Social Security Checks unless they have worked for a minimum of 20 YEARS in the US. What kind of bull is this?

Where is the ACLU, or the leftist idiots, or the bleeding heart attorneys when it comes to defending the rights of the REAL AMERICANS, i.e. Vets, or the old who live in rat infested Hotels owned by Hindus who steal from the Americans every penny they have.

How about tell our U.S government not to give the:

$84,854,827,200 in Foreign Aid to Israel since 1949

$1.4 billion to more than 30 African nations In 2004

Giving Pakistan $750 million over five years to develop its troubled tribal areas bordering Afghanistan

2000-2001: US gives Taliban-ruled Afghanistan $245 million in "aid."

January 12 2007 Jerusalem -- In a move fraught with risk and historical ironies, the Bush administration is preparing to pour $86 million into strengthening security forces loyal to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas

U.S. gives Ethiopia $37 million in food aid and $84m for Aids

The US has provided Egypt with $1.3 billion a year in military aid since 1979, and an average of $815 million a year in economic assistance. All told, Egypt has received over $50 billion in US largesse since 1975.

Each year USAID gives $200 million to the Egyptian government in cash handouts to do with as it pleases

Iraq - In 2004, it will become the largest recipient of US aid, receiving $18.4 billion.

Israel - The largest recipient of US largesse in 2003, getting $2.1 billion in military aid annually; $600 million in economic aid.

Egypt - Out of a US foreign aid budget of about $14 billion in 2003, Egypt was the second largest recipient with $1.3 billion in military aid; $615 million for social programs.

Colombia - Got $540 million to battle the drug trade, and local terrorist groups.

Jordan - Got $250 million in economic support; $198 in military financing.

Peru, Ukraine, Russia - Received approximately $200 million each in economic and military aid annually.

WHY NOT COMPLAIN TO THE GOVERNMENT ABOUT THOSE!!!
Why is it we give to everyone but our closest neighbors, that just want to work!!! And why do we still have poor and hungry in the U.S?

Direct some of the hatred at the real "criminals" the government!!!


Again, I will say, I am not for opening the border and I am not saying give them all Citizenship.


I am fighting for the good ones, if they are all documented with limited rights, we will be able to see who is bad, who are criminals, who live off the system...and we will be able to determine who should be deported.

The point is that they will always come and we are just wasting time & money fighting a fight that will never end. If it was such a threat the government would be making a real effort to get rid of them, but they are not, they are doing just enough to shut you up. The government knows that most of these countries depend on the money sent back by the Hispanics as part of their survival, it would be sure to cause a war if it stopped. Anyway, I am not getting into all that right now.

I am just trying to figure out an alternative to the "unrealistic" plan to deport them all, which no one else seems to be doing.

Let's say the government comes and says we are not deporting them, what would satisfy you? Has anyone thought of a middle ground? That is what i am trying to do, because I know they aren't going to deport them.

quote:

I am fighting for the good ones, if they are all documented with limited rights, we will be able to see who is bad, who are criminals, who live off the system...and we will be able to determine who should be deported.

The point is that they will always come and we are just wasting time & money fighting a fight that will never end. If it was such a threat the government would be making a real effort to get rid of them, but they are not, they are doing just enough to shut you up. The government knows that most of these countries depend on the money sent back by the Hispanics as part of their survival, it would be sure to cause a war if it stopped. Anyway, I am not getting into all that right now.

I am just trying to figure out an alternative to the "unrealistic" plan to deport them all, which no one else seems to be doing.

Let's say the government comes and says we are not deporting them, what would satisfy you? Has anyone thought of a middle ground? That is what i am trying to do, because I know they aren't going to deport them.

Amen, amen, I say to you......
- there's no mass deportation in the offing;
- no blanket amnesty; and
- no mass exodus of undocumented aliens back to their home countries ON THEIR OWN.

That's why the US Congress is looking for the magic formula that will BOTH survive partisan politics and fix the current crisis beneficial to the US that never recurs.

Therefore, I say to you.......
- anybody who is opposed to this idea upholds the status quo (that provides "amnesty" by default);

- anybody who is unwilling to put a STOP to the uncontrolled increase of illegal immigrants (boarder crossers & visa overtayers);

- anybody who thinks that the situation is NORMAL and PERFECT and is meant to be so;

- anybody who micro-manages the mess by "only" bashing the illegals (how bad they are and the problems they cause);

hence, he/she is the GREATEST ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT (IMMIGRATION) SUPPORTER of all!

This is a pernicious problem, real immigration reform doesn't have anything to do with amnesty. If you have a broken pipe, you'll also have a big spill to clean up. In this case, the law represents the broken pipe, it fails to address the realities of immigration in a comprehensive, fair, humane and efficient manner. The spill is the millions of illegal aliens now living "in the shadows".

If you clean up the spill and leave the pipe untouched, you'll have another spill to clean up later down the road. It's as simple as that.

Immigration reform must address every issue in a realistic way, border protection is required but it's not enough. Right now you have plenty of penalties prescribed for those who break the law, under immigration law and under criminal law, but the law is not efficient and resources are very limited. Border security is perhaps the easiest problem to tackle, giving more resources to DHS along with strict oversight will produce immediate results.

However, as long as the law remains basically unaltered, there's no reason to believe the problem is going to disappear. Back in 1996 the law was made tougher, harsher, much more restrictive; do I need to tell you what happened after in terms of illegal immigration?

Legalizations are only a clean up measure, but sadly they have become the focus of the legislation. This is a big mistake that occurred in the past, a mistake that shouldn't happen again. If legalization is needed, but without true and genuine reform it'll become yet another amnesty even if the program is restricted with meaningless "touchback" provisions.

quote:

Originally posted by SICKOFILLEGALS:
Where is the ACLU, or the leftist idiots, or the bleeding heart attorneys when it comes to defending the rights of the REAL AMERICANS, i.e. Vets, or the old who live in rat infested Hotels owned by Hindus who steal from the Americans every penny they have.

For fourteen years I've given generously on a bi-monthly basis to the Paralyzed Veterans and Disabled American Veterans. Many, many other requests came from other organizations, churches, and you name it sending me address labels, calendars, and other items. The paralyzed and disabled veterans were my first choice and only choice. I regret not thoroughly reading news articles regarding them albeit a couple ring in my mind. I'm not aware of which organizations advocate for them but they do deserve attention such as the attention our illegal immigration reform is getting. I've no family members of whom are veterans. My donations have just been a conviction I've had for our American veterans. It touched me to see that there are men and women with limited or no limbs and whom have the desire and ambition to be creative with their arts and crafts keeping their spirits uplifted. At the same time I'm able-bodied to live a full and meaningful life because of these men and women. Maybe I've deluded myself by thinking that were groups who were keeping check on our veterans. They should never have to live in sub-standard conditions. This posting does deserve our attention and respect for our veterans. I'm sure all of us, despite our differences in opinions, are patriotic in our own ways. I would like to ask all the posters, if you will, to at least take a moment and add a positive thought to your posting in respect for our U.S. veterans. Amist all our arguing, lets not forget them - they deserve our support and our respect especially of late.