quote:

Originally posted by davdah:
Hudson, you should go back and read the posts. The women has a job and a large network of relatives. I doubt she will have any difficulty in obtaining help with legal fees if she goes that route. His mother can not be sued if she helps her own son out with legal expenses. Christ do you want to deny him any defense at all!

A support group may be helpful but not one of those 'self pitty' groups. He needs to aggressively defend himself. If he doesn't who will? Leave up to her honesty and integrety? A women who used him to support her all the while cheating on him behind his back. She is the pillar of virtue! He should explore the possiblity of getting her booted if at all possible. Or is it such a terrible thing for him to have some digintity and not allow her to spit in his face anymore. Oh, wait. He's a man. Guilty of everything, deserving of nothing. Got it. Now I understand.

Davdah,
Reread the posts again. She is in school with a grant, most, if not all of the family is still in the home country, and, according to him, the mutual friends have sided with her. He also stated and asked where will she go and with what money if she left. To me, that does not sound like a lot of money. The lawsuit is based on the position that if she is helping him and hiding assets, namely bank accounts. She could be called in by him as a witness in the divorce.

But I do not believe she will try to aggressively ask for anything since he is in no position to offer spousal support, much anything else. I could be wrong. She could be persuaded by someone in your aggressive nature to ask for everything. But it depends on who wants to be the asswhipe in this case.

From my perspective, I saw a lack of communication as one of the cornerstones why the marriage fell apart. I am not saying it is his fault only, nor hers, but the lack of communication complicated the marriage. there was obviously issues from the moment. He obviously tried. She may or may not have tried to resolve the differences. And what is equally glaring is that we do not know her side of the story. And this is where the ex comes in. He admitted the communications he discovered were recent and he believed they were occurring for a much longer period. If he decides to bring this into evidence, what do you think her response will be now that she has a lawyer? Do you think it will be, "yes I am guilty. Have mercy on me?" She will respond in kind and in force and who would blame her, from her point of view.

That is why when he goes to an attorney, he needs to have an open mind. He also needs to go to at least two, if not three attorneys to see if they offer a different opinion. My opinion is that a no fault divorce is the best possible alternative. It will not give her the excuse to be aggressive and it does not expose him to any unnecessary expense, exposure, and grief. But if he goes in there with the decision already made or is thinking that he wants, the attorney will not turn down the business. Of course, he will not realize that it will cost him dearly in both money and stress. His business may suffer for it, etc as well as becoming bitter, as you have with your three divorces, Davdah.

Hudson, I don't think Davdah is bitter...moreso, I think he is objective and in being so it offers up other possible avenues that the actual divorce could proceed in. Like you said, you don't know her side of the story - and I can't quite possibly show her all of this and try to get her involved TO offer up her side of the story, if she in fact has created one all by her own self. I'm quite sure she has since I've already received a phone call from one of our previous mutual friends, whom I'm quite certain is more on her side, trying to "needle me" into telling her what I'm up too.
With a full heart and total honesty here Hudson, I've not sugar-coated anything here. Why would I?! Go back and read my very first post - I read it and I can feel that horror and pain all over again. Between you and Davdah, you've both given me insights and avenues that I've never thought of and would never think of. I appreciate you both being open with your thoughts whether they were nice or not. Mentoring as it may be termed is the ability to teach someone about something whether they like it or not...it's the only way we grow up. I needed to be mentored - who else would have done it???? Who else had all the experiences as you and Davdah have had?
Had I known all the answers to what I'm facing and quite honestly the horrors I've been through, I would have never sought out some kind of help. I'm still quite scared, honestly. I'm already feeling the realization of the end of it all - when I think of the good, it tears me apart; and then the thought of, "my God was this all an illusion?" kicks in, it hurts me even more! From here, I have to agree with whoever spoke of going to speak to a councelor, maybe even at the church to help me through the pains...I don't want to carry around this anger, and it wouldn't be fair to hold my experiences against the possibility of someone new.
I doubt that will happen for a long time. Now I understand why my lawyer said she will never get married. I asked her one time, "why not!?" She said because she has handled so many divorces in her experience the mere thought of it all frightens her. I thought, "wow."
Oh, to iperson: No she hasn't moved out yet - I think her one girlfriend is trying to hook her up with another single Ukrainain man that lives in the Philly area. I'm hoping she is. This would be the same girlfriend that recently called me for "information." I don't know, really...but recently she's been collecting up her belongings around the house and getting them in one place....so I have to think something's up. I haven't approached her about it, and I'm not going too either. Maybe I should give my lawyer another call about that - that she's preparing for "something" and maybe I should have the papers in hand for her to sign?????

I begin to think this woman (your wife) has lost her mind or she is one of those blonde women.

Never mind. You wrote that she is from Ukraine and at the same time you mentioned Poland. Is she Ukrainian or Polish? You know those are two different countries.

Also, about her citizenship. You said that she is waiting to apply for it as soon as she is eligible in half a year and you wanted to wait till then not to have to support her.
She may apply in half a year but how long it'll take for her to get the interview and then the naturalization date, it may be another couple of years. So it's good you're getting a divorce right now. I hope you're drawing the documents already.

Another point I was trying to raise is you can not depend on a person to stop doing evil when that is all you are getting from them.
People are driven by motivation. What has she been motivated to do? Anything nice?, I don't think so. What would change that?

Once she visits a lawyer a couple things are going to happen. One is, the attorney will want to know how are they going to get paid. Two, to exasperate the situation to increase their fees. I've never known or heard of a lawyer who tried to keep the peace and be reasonable with the opposing side. It goes against the first rule of defense. 'To provide a vigorous defense to the client' Doesn't matter what is right or wrong, guilty or not. One of the reasons many people have such a hard time with lawyers who defend obviously guilty murderes etc. Anyone who reads this, man or women who has gone through a divorce has seen it. In the papers you received from opposing council was there anything aside slander and malice directed at you? I didn't think so. But that is all part of the show that goes on in the average court room.

I am by no means bitter. Just the reality of what the situation will probably turn into. A no fault divorce or not doesn't preclude her from asking for the moon and the stars and accusing him of everything under the sun to justify it. Poor or not she will probably ask for something. Alimony or spousal support is based on a percentage of income. There is no floor limit. In some states, like Texas, there is a ceiling. Thank God.

And if the mother helps him, so what. By the same token Mike here should depose anyone and subpeoana the accounts etc. of anyone who helps her. Sue them all. That is foolish and over reactionary. Wouldn't happen. He shouldn't worry about his mom being sued by the iron curtain mob.

If he were able to sit down with her and talk this out and not use lawyers at all and feel comfortable with her cooperation I would be the first to say DO IT. If that happens, congrats. You got off cheap.

Hello.."long time - didn't write." Happy New Year to all. I thought I would add on to this: She moved out back in October, telling me prior for a month that she was moving in with her one girlfriend, Natasha and her AMerican idiot..I mean, husband. Two days before she moved out, my mother comes up to me and begins to tell me that she's moving in with Charlie....my MOTHER'S BOYFRIEND! Don't ask, I don't know. He, Charlie, didn't say anything to my mother until the time of the move was apparent. So, it was like this: Friday, Charlie tells my mother. Sunday, she moves out. Monday, she's sitting at my kitchen table taking a break from moving and I point blank ask her, "does your parents know about Dimitry?(her ex husband being back in the picture)" I caught her off-guard and she said "yes" in that off-guard voice of hers Two weeks later as my mother and I were trying to understand what the F was going through Charlie'e head, he apparently tells my mother that it's a good thing she moved in with him so he can keep the other russian friends at bay and stop any influences of her getting a lawyer. The following week I got a letter in the mail from my lawyer about her lawyer! The fun began....
I met with my lawyer again in December to find out she's not trying to get alimony from me or anything else. I think those few times I told her I had nothing that she could take from me must have gotten through. Someone told her to get a lawyer to just be with her while she signs the papers and she's requesting again for her last name to be changed back to her maiden name. Had she not gotten a lawyer, all would have been completed on January 4th. As of now, I'm still waiting to hear from her lawyer if she is going to contest anything or try to get anything from me.
In the meantime, and very very carefully, my mother started getting her things back from Charlie and I paid to have her locks and my locks changed on both our houses.
This has all been a long living nightmare. I truely loved her, her family, her friends, her country. I think the reality of it being done and over has finally set it as I haven't slept in nights. But it could have always been worse: #1: my house and my property could have been in MY name, #2: she could have gotten pregnant, #3: I may never have had the smarts to break away and start researching who the **** I had really just married when the first 'red flag' went up.
I've seen it before: a really big red flag goes up and the man says, "oh it's just a thing women do...", or "she'll be alright", or, "she'll get over it..." I'm quite fortunate and blessed that after my two red flags I got really nervous and looked into what she was up too. I'm so sorry to anyone here that's gone through something similar. I"m still going through it and recently the reality of it all is really hitting me. I can't imagine what it would be like if it were any worse...but it sure doesn't make the pain of what i'm going through any easier. If the issue of some kind of support comes up for her, I'm definitely getting myself an immigrations lawyer and getting her *** deported, if it's possible. I think it's possible as long as she's not a citizen yet. I need to research this issue more.

Welcome back and thanks for updating us! Hope you stay with us a while again. Sounds like a real nightmare but appears you're pulling right through it. Hang in there and fight for your rights no matter what it takes!

Good luck Mike! Hang in there, don't give up!

Hi Mike,

I read your story and was just amazed to see how some people are totally heartless.

What doesn't kill you will make you stronger. She's gone and you are much better off without her - who knows, somebody is out there for you? Good luck!

Mike, what you went through happened to me as well. Mine was also Russian. I married her in Russia. She was warm affectionate and the love of my life, my whole future. When she stepped off the plane she was a cold as ice. I wondered what happened. Was there a misunderstanding on her part? I tried to show her I would be the best husband and did everything she asked including adjustment of status three weeks after she arrived. After this concern of her's was lifted off her shoulders instead of not being worried and withdrawn she became colder, much colder. After 2 more weeks of this treatment I went to an immigration attorney. He told me I had been set up by her to get a greencard and once she got it she would leave me. He advised me to get out as soon as I can and recommended a divorce lawyer that had allot of experience representing foreign women. I seen this attorney and he told me the same about getting out quickly and the possibility of having false abuse charges levied against me. I asked him what were the possibility of those and he said "100%, they have everything to gain and nothing to lose bu doing so". So I secretly made arrangements to divorce. My wife was in contact with her former mother-in-law about her ex. These two were working together along with my wife's mother in on the scam. There were of course "emergencies" that needing money to take care of her mother. I played the witless fool and good naturally went along with her as my attorneys were drafting my exit plans. Finally the divorce was set in motion. I separated and did not see her. 2 weeks went by when she filed a restraining order based on her wild stories from what supposedly happened weeks before. I seen her for the last time at the trial. I was found guilty of "pushing and shoving" based on her word alone. It had never happened. The judge said he didn't believe all the other charges "no evidence". 9 months later she got her greencard as an abused spouse of a USC. My financial costs in this were very slight but they were heavy in regard to the emotional toll. I have found out since that this is not unusual. To have such hope and then find out that one has been deceived not just once by his wife but a second time by his government (USCIS, VAWA staff at VSC, the courts) is more than most people can take.

Hang in there as the above people are saying. Keep in mind that we just made a bad choice in wives. Not all women are like this. I have found a number of women American or foreign who are very supportive and kind to men like us. They know how some of their "sisters" are and despise them for what they do. Good luck!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: max-one,

Hi Max-one,

You're right! Despite the prevalence of these fraud marriages, there are some of us who are indeed married and are enjoying a true relationship.

Good luck!

Glad to hear you got out relatively unscathed. With your mother's boyfriend!? And we wonder where they get the scripts for some of the good dramas!

One thing you may want to do is NOT say anything negative about her status. If she suspects you may not go along with the removal of conditions then expect a vawa claim. In fact I would go so far as to tell her you will go along with the self petition of condition removal based on a bona fide marriage. At least until the divorce is final. Without any claims of abuse in the divorce she will have a hard time proving a vawa claim. Once the divorce is signed and sealed send all info to USCIS about what she was doing with the X and how you were used for a GC.

quote:

Originally posted by Mrs. B.:
Hi Max-one,

You're right! Despite the prevalence of these fraud marriages, there are some of us who are indeed married and are enjoying a true relationship.

Good luck!

Yes this can not be stressed enough. There are allot of decent loving foreign wives. Thanks for the Good Luck.

To max-one: WOW! I know this may sound weird, but it's kinda nice to hear from someone else who's been through that 'emotional trauma.' I'm assuming you didn't have any children with her either? I know it can always be worse; it just doesn't make the pain any easier.
To Mrs.B. Thank you very much for your kind words. Presently I'm biting my tongue and waiting for everything to be finalized. Maybe in the future the REAL "right one" will come along and I will keep an eye out for her; but I'll definitely never try to make something happen again. My head is STILL spinning with how badly I was deceived. I really loved her, her family, and her friends...it was all a lie. That pain is something they don't make medicines for.
Davdah, hello again! Fortunately thus far I have had no contact with her. She's out of my home(one way or the other...(my mom's boyfriend???)) before any vawa claims came up...thanks to you for that info way back when. She can't claim anything like that against me; or if she does i'll have to handle it as it comes. I'm waiting to hear from our courts here for the "hearing." I believe this is where she'll say she wants her name changed back to her maiden name, and whatever else she thinks she'll get from me. If suddenly large quantities of money are spoken about....I'd like to then "politely" remind her that I was divorcing her with irreconcible differences....perhaps then I could go after her for adultery? Or does that need to be "politiely mentioned" between the two lawyers now?
I can't prove there was a physical relationship between her and her ex, but I can surely show enough evidence that anyone with 'half-a-brain' can figure there was, especially last summer. Just the fact that she's been in communications with him without my knowledge shows deceit. I was told by a friend of mine that with everything I have, I can show that she had no intentions of staying in this marriage with me, that I was being deceived. Perhaps at any hearing if it gets suddenly worse, I could politiely remind her and her councelor of this evidence??? Or no???
Or should I just let things fall as they may, and after all's done with the divorce, go to the INS (USCIS, whatever)?
It seems pointless after the fact...
It could have been a lot worse for me. There could have been children involved! My home and property could have been in MY name! So many things could have happened that didn't.

Should I really pursue getting her removed from the country, or should I let her continue on with her new life?
She's in college (on a state grant) and she's got full-time work. I've lost five years of my life that I'll never get back. I don't want to spend any more time hating her for taking those years from me. Should I work on having her removed or should I leave it alone...any opinions?
Thank you very much again for all your kind words everyone!!! The holidays were quite hard on me being alone, as you can imagine.
All's good now - new year and new season!

quote:

I don't want to spend any more time hating her for taking those years from me. Should I work on having her removed or should I leave it alone...any opinions?

Hi Mike,

I think it would be best to move on with your life. You should focus your efforts on moving forward (not looking back). Just my opinion. I wish you the best in any case.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: ProudUSC,

quote:

Originally posted by ProudUSC:

quote:

I don't want to spend any more time hating her for taking those years from me. Should I work on having her removed or should I leave it alone...any opinions?

Hi Mike,

I think it would be best to move on with your life. You should focus you efforts on moving forward (not looking back). Just my opinion. I wish you the best in any case.

Women can be very ruthless. What's worse, they get preferrential treatment in divorce courts. Can you believe that - the guy is convicted of abuse just because his wife said so? What happened to the need to show the proof for one's accusations?! Insane!

quote:

I can't prove there was a physical relationship between her and her ex, but I can surely show enough evidence that anyone with 'half-a-brain' can figure there was, especially last summer. Just the fact that she's been in communications with him without my knowledge shows deceit. I was told by a friend of mine that with everything I have, I can show that she had no intentions of staying in this marriage with me, that I was being deceived. Perhaps at any hearing if it gets suddenly worse, I could politiely remind her and her councelor of this evidence??? Or no???
Or should I just let things fall as they may, and after all's done with the divorce, go to the INS (USCIS, whatever)?
It seems pointless after the fact...
It could have been a lot worse for me. There could have been children involved! My home and property could have been in MY name! So many things could have happened that didn't.

Should I really pursue getting her removed from the country, or should I let her continue on with her new life

Mike,
Whether she had an emotional affair with her ex or not, it does not prove FRAUD. It may prove unfaithfullness in a divorce. Two seperate matters altogether. Trying to get her kicked out because she hurt you will only prove she was right about you all along. Makes your case harder to deal with in a positive light and eventually, you might say things in court not entirely correct. Don't go down that slippery slope.

If things get worse, you could use your "trump card." However, it is quite possible that her side also knows this and may have planned for such a contengency. It could backfire or it could not. Remember, any evidence you have will need to be given to the other side for expulasory reasons. Failure to do so brings more trouble legally.

II still maintain my premise that the two of you married for the wrong reasons. Again, I am sorry that your marriage ended up in divorce. And I was the one who suggested counseling. Your "property" are protected because they are really not your property since it is in your mother's name. There is very little she can get out of you except alimony based on your business income and that is about it. From what you described, it had a modest income.

Please get out right now. you can go to the immigration office in your area and present your evidence and by all means get a divorce before she files for her citizenship. I found out the hard way of trying to make a marriage work with a person that don't love you. My husband is from nigeria and stayied with my long enough to get his citizenship and 24 days later he abandoned me and said that the marriage was over. My friends and family tried to warn me that he didn't really love me but I always made excuse for the way that he treated me. In the end everyone was right and I was wrong. I cried for over 2 weeks and couldn't eat. But now I am putting myself back together. At all cost protect yourself. If you wait until she receives her citizenship then there is not to much that you can do.
Living with it now and it is cruel and hard but moving on alone now