Originally posted by ALLFAIR: PoLiTiCs iS WhEn yOu sAy yOu aRe gOiNg tO Do oNe tHiNg wHiLe iNtEnDiNg tO Do aNoThEr. ThEn yOu dO NeItHeR WhAt yOu sAiD NoR WhAt yOu iNtEnDeD.
Saddam Hussein
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Here is a classic government /media frenzy. Remember Richard Jewel? I dont think there was one person in america other than Jewel himself that did not believe he was NOT GUILTY OF THE BOMBING. NO EVIDENCE, not even circumstancial. Hmmm.. Sound familiar?
Unbelievable that this could happen in America in this day and age. But it did, and it continues to happen..... The time was the 1996 Olympics......
You'll hear the word "closure" a lot with regard to the Eric Rudolph case, and if you have no idea who Rudolph is, you're probably living a wonderful life. He's the humanoid who bombed Centennial Park at the 1996 Atlanta Olympics, bombed a ******* night club, bombed two abortion clinics, killed two people, maimed a nurse, and injured 120 folks unlucky enough to be caught on planet Earth in the same tiny sliver of lifetime as this unbridled loser.
Now Rudolph has cut a deal with federal officials under which he will go to prison for the rest of his natural life but avoid the death penalty. He also already has led authorities to more than 250 pounds of buried dynamite. It was a good trade for the government.
But closure? Well, let's run that one past Richard Jewell.
Remember that name, Richard Jewell? You may, and there's a reason for it: He is the man who was identified, first privately by federal investigators and then publicly on the screaming front page of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, as the No. 1 suspect in the Olympic bombing case.
It was an almost unbelievable story, incredible in its irony. On the night of the bombing, a sweltering July post-midnight party in the park that turned into a terror siege, Richard Jewell had emerged as a hero -- a security guard who had alerted fellow workers to the abandoned backpack that wound up being a bomb, moving them away from it before it detonated; a man who helped evacuate panicky Olympic visitors from the park in the hazy wake of the tragedy.
Only later did the word leak out that investigators had decided Jewell was suspicious more than heroic. Only then, a few days after the blast, when the newspaper named him as the top guy on the FBI's list, did people begin to realize that, now that they thought about it, Jewell almost perfectly fit the role of a madman bomber.
After all, Jewell, a portly type who took a bad photograph, lived a loner's existence in an apartment with his mom. And he was a wannabe cop, a security guard with designs on getting into a police academy and maybe joining the force someday. He was obviously starved for attention; otherwise, he wouldn't have been so willing to do those TV and newspaper interviews that he granted with such immediacy in the aftermath of the bombing and his "help" in Centennial Park.
It all added up. The thing got rolling. The worldwide media had a ready-made villain. Again, incredible story: The guy who pretended to be helping people that terrible night was really an American who bombed the park to begin with. It had an awfulness that just rang of some kind of truth.
And it was, of course, a complete crock.
The case against Richard Jewell was bad from the start; the FBI sent Jewell's attorney a letter within three months of beginning its investigation to tell him Jewell was not a suspect. But it didn't matter out there in the public and in the media, where Jewell already had been tried and convicted by the people who needed their vengeance sooner than the government was able to provide.
It took authorities seven years, in fact, before they were able to bring in Eric Rudolph, the man who actually appears as the kind of soulless cretin that people wanted to believe Richard Jewell to be. Rudolph, a man with reported ties to a white supremacist religion that is anti-***, anti-Semitic and anti-abortion, had managed to evade capture for much of that time by living in survivalist style in the mountains of western North Carolina.
His ability to elude the agents searching for him was reported, along with his identification as a person quite possibly connected with the Olympic tragedy and the other bombings as well. But he wasn't caught, and he wasn't caught; and in the meantime, Richard Jewell's was really the only name out there.
When Rudolph was brought in two years ago, Jewell's lawyer, Lin Wood, didn't sound too hopeful that the arrest would bring to an end the damage done to Jewell's life. "The portrayal of Richard Jewell as the bomber was so intense," Wood said at the time. "Richard is always remembered as the person who bombed the park and is never remembered as the man who reacted heroically that night to save so many lives."
Wood commented again on Friday, saying that it wouldn't be difficult to imagine Jewell's feeling of "final and total vindication" at hearing the news of Eric Rudolph's arranged guilty plea. Imagining it will have to do; Jewell, his life wrecked beyond all reason, has long since gone underground.
He lives in an undisclosed Georgia town now, a place where, some might say fittingly, he finally realized his dream of becoming a police officer. He has moved forward in his life. But closure in the Olympic bombing case? That's a word for just about everybody but Richard Jewell, the most notorious hero of the age.
The news release of Richard Jewel's innocense was reported on page 8 in most newspapers in small print article. Richard Jewel died 10 years later at the age of 44. Shame! This story forever changed the way I began to think. Embarrassed to say, but I was one of those naive believers.
Psst. Please note that the word "terrorist" was not used in referernce to Eric Rudolph, but best believe it that if he was arabic or muslim...
Sure, this happens. Where someone is accused and later acquited. Getting back to the towers. A tall subject indeed.
If 7 was brought down by our people I would assume it was a done very quickly so as to avoid having it fall on its own and causing even more damage. Normally a demolition takes a lot of planning. In an emergency there is no time so I would surmise they compressed the normal time required.
Don't take this the wrong way. The only strange item I noticed was how both towers came straight down. While watching them both burn I expected the second to come down first due to the lower hit and obvious greater pressure on the weakened structure. Perhaps that is how they are designed. That when they collapse (normal demolition) they come straight down and not topple left or right.
Our hats should go off to the engineers for the design which kept all buildings concerned from falling long way down the street.
Lastly, for any crime there must be motive. Why? What possible gain could there be for our own government to do this? And to risk being caught. If an inside job hundreds of people would have been privy to the knowledge. Not a one has been heard from. It was what it was. An islamo terrorist strike.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
Originally posted by iperson: I would have to agree with Davdah on this. I do not believe in any conspiracy theories about 9/11. I knew they'd start cropping up as soon as a few years pass, and it's natural, but believe me, my opinion on this is quite informed. So no, no government involvement in 9/11, other than ignorance of intelligence data.
Really Iperson
These theories are not new. they came about almost immediately. The implosion style fall of the towers were the catalyst. They overdid it. Then the coverups. And the grandaddy of them all was the ridiculous nonsense of Iraq ,
You have not offered anything to support your informed opinion that GWB was not involved. Just your say so. Where is the govt proof that OBL was connected to these men on the fbi list and that he was the one that planned 911.
Dont even go to the so called video tape that Bush claims that is the evidence, because this administration has already been caught faking or editing OBL tapes. OBL appears to have been fictional then and even more so now. A conveinient phantom . Where is the proof that this was done by isalamic terrorists?
NOne.. not one of these people on the list was from Iraq. More than half were from Saudi Arabia.. Why were we not looking lookinh there
Originally posted by davdah: Sure, this happens. Where someone is accused and later acquited. Getting back to the towers. A tall subject indeed.
If 7 was brought down by our people I would assume it was a done very quickly so as to avoid having it fall on its own and causing even more damage. Normally a demolition takes a lot of planning. In an emergency there is no time so I would surmise they compressed the normal time required.
Perhaps it was done at an earlier date.. same timeframe that the twin towers were done. I would have to investigate if the same odd special/secret "security checks" were done at tower 7 like they were at the twins. As I recall, I think they were because the files were moved to differnt area. The ones that conveniently got destroyed.
Don't take this the wrong way. The only strange item I noticed was how both towers came straight down. While watching them both burn I expected the second to come down first due to the lower hit and obvious greater pressure on the weakened structure. Perhaps that is how they are designed. That when they collapse (normal demolition) they come straight down and not topple left or right.
Our hats should go off to the engineers for the design which kept all buildings concerned from falling long way down the street.
I think you are referring to the expert demolition specialists
Lastly, for any crime there must be motive. Why? What possible gain could there be for our own government to do this? And to risk being caught. If an inside job hundreds of people would have been privy to the knowledge. Not a one has been heard from. It was what it was. An islamo terrorist strike.
The motive? Isnt that obivious, The excuse to invade Iraq. This was GWB being rogue with playmate Tony blair.( remember this is all under the direction of Daddy Bush) CIA is thorough like that. Silverstein got a great payoff deal. Guiliani is in the pocket. compromised. Each got his own task to do on a need to know basis for their part.
How many million offered for OBL and not even a trace. Very hard to believe indeed. I just wonder how much OBL was paid to be the fall guy for this operation.
4now, you will investigate? How will you do that? Will you have access to airline manifests? Will you have access to visitor records of the the trade center? How about demolition records? Any of those things? I don't think so.
And exactly what do you really know about the CIA aside the hollywood version? Daddy Bush, Blair, WTH? The speculation your putting forwards is dangerously close to treason. Taking the side of binladen now? A fall guy, ARE YOU CRAZY! Did it ever occur to you the web sites you are visiting might be set up as a disinformation propaganda machine by the very people who are guilty? Run a who-is check on the site before giving it a stamp of credibility. Just because its different doesn't make it right. 4 your information.
Thanks Ipers, for once we agree.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
Originally posted by iperson: Come on 4now, stop all this nonsense. Bin Laden left a signature on this attack. The first two flights were from Boston to LA. B-LA- Bin Laden. I think it's clear enough, and not a coincidence. This means nobody knew about it in the US, and the US government wasn't involved in any way.
Really
why all the training ops on the very same day and time iperson..? with some of the same targets? Why air traffic controller ask real or ops?
Why GWB reaction while reading the book? open your eyes. Iraq is the biggest clue that it was not above board.
GWB had a part in this orchestration directed by daddy bush former cia director.
The airspace in and around the pentagon is referred to as 'prohibited'. Meaning, thou shalt not enter without specific clearance less ye be shot down. It is very common to perform simulations and drills to keep everyone sharp on what to do during an actual attack. This pre-dates 9-11. Oh, but they left that part out.
Concerning the ops occurring during the same date and time. Where is your source? Who said it? Anything official? No, just more 3rd party conspiracy theorists and possibly dis-information. Park near the pentagon on any day of the week. More than likely you will see military aircraft at some point during the day.
If GW wanted to invade Iraq we didn't need to blow up any buildings here. We already had the pre-kuwait invasion and subsequent UN violations as justification enough. That is if we were fishing for excuses.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
once again the government expects us to take this Osama tapes on good faith. "trust us" is what they are basically saying. i know thats not a problem for you 911poller, as you are a world class sheep/shill/lemming who trusts the government/corporate media to tell you everything. but for most of us, thats not something we can easily do. we expect PROOF from our government unlike you davdah . something they still havent given us.
Does it frighten anyone else that top members of st911 have stated as fact:
1. More than one of the bin Laden tapes are fake. 2. The faked tapes were produced by the government. 3. The 19 hijackers were not all killed. 4. The implication that the translators were in on it. 5. Voice morphing technology was used! 6. Mark Bingham's call was also faked. 7. The Pentagon tapes were also manipulated.
What sort of proof can be supplied? You want to interview the clowns who flew the planes?
World class? Yes, I've been outside our borders several times. I know enough about the media and military to know that what you see isn't always the entire picture. Most of it for good reason. The enemy listens too.
Its you who needs to provide hard evidence to say it wasn't what it is. Where is your proof? Michael Moore isn't good enough. A fat sensationalist who back stabbed everyone in his path for self glorification.
Web sites spawned by conspiracy theorist hiding out in the bunkers waiting for WW III suffering from paranoid delusions. Not exactly credible. Your willing to trust the word of someone who has no access nor valid evidence to substantiate any of their claims. I think its you who is the lamb.
There is no substantive motive. That needs to be provided first before you can move forward with piecing together an elaborate puzzle like this.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
For your so called fact list. Where is the supporting evidence. Start with what top members? What qualifies as a top member? Credentials and maybe throw in their motivations.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
Originally posted by davdah: 4now, you will investigate? How will you do that? Will you have access to airline manifests? Will you have access to visitor records of the the trade center? How about demolition records? Any of those things? I don't think so.
The airline manifests did not include any of the hijackers name according to sources on the retrieved records. This was from the very beginning. Why has this not been debunked?
And exactly what do you really know about the CIA aside the hollywood version? Daddy Bush, Blair, WTH?
I am not into hollywood fantasy.. I try only to work with reality and fact findings. What does anyone know for real about this secret organization. I know that they are drug dealers that sell drugs for funding... and so do you
The speculation your putting forwards is dangerously close to treason.
How is it treason? Search for truth is treason? Are you saying that searching for the truth is the same as trying to overthrow the government?
Taking the side of binladen now? A fall guy, ARE YOU CRAZY! Did it ever occur to you the web sites you are visiting might be set up as a disinformation propaganda machine by the very people who are guilty? Run a who-is check on the site before giving it a stamp of credibility. Just because its different doesn't make it right. 4 your information.
How is it taking the side of the phantom figure OBL? I am looking for truth and logic. What the government gave me made no sense. I watched this in 2001... ok but when those buildings fell like they did, I know an implosion when I see one. I waited to hear that they were pre rigged, but instead nonsense spin was given and I immediately became suspicious of everything . I said.. wow only Mossad could pull off something like that. The flight 93 lies also made me suspicious. I was not alone in my thinking and it seemed as I found others that had the same thoughts that I had. (God bless internet) So then I had to take everything being reported with a grain of salt, and I immediately saw the scares coming... it read like the iranian scares, the japenese scares, the red commie scares, Now the muslim/arabic scares... Global Weather scare coming soon. Yes there are many conspircy theories out there.. the conspiracies are many, but they are all made off of the distortion of facts and ommisions in regards to 911.
I have not much changed my thinking in all these years now, and really have become more convinced over the years with each coverup and faked release tapes to try to cause fear and terror within america and with its people.
If iraq was a pressing issue , we would have been there for the right reason long before 911.. It was not going to be approved. They needed a big reason that would have the support of the "patriotic" mob lynch mentality people to cheer them on to go get those WMD that had nothing to do with the OBL character that GWB claimed did the murdereous acts of 911.
Thanks Ipers, for once we agree. Thiis is historic, indeed
The airline manifests did not include any of the hijackers name according to sources on the retrieved records. This was from the very beginning. Why has this not been debunked?
What sources? And, what about the calls from the passengers on the flight that crashed in PA? All those families told the same story. Are they all in on it? All sacrificed their family members to be part of a cover up?
quote:
I am not into hollywood fantasy.. I try only to work with reality and fact findings. What does anyone know for real about this secret organization. I know that they are drug dealers that sell drugs for funding... and so do you
Again from Hollywood. Show me the testimony from a credible source that proves that. It doesn't exist.
The fact is there is no way for you or me to adequately investigate any theory to debunk what we already know to be true.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
The airline manifests did not include any of the hijackers name according to sources on the retrieved records. This was from the very beginning. Why has this not been debunked?
ok upon investigation.. I have found that the lists offered by cnn and others were not official airline manifest that do not show arabic names. The Boston Globe reported AA setating list that shows 5 names.
So we still need to find 14 more, and I believe it is said that 6 of these are actually alive and doing well. so 8 or 9 have to be accounted for on a manifest.
What sources? And, what about the calls from the passengers on the flight that crashed in PA? All those families told the same story. Are they all in on it? All sacrificed their family members to be part of a cover up?
i will follow up
quote:
I am not into hollywood fantasy.. I try only to work with reality and fact findings. What does anyone know for real about this secret organization. I know that they are drug dealers that sell drugs for funding... and so do you
Again from Hollywood. Show me the testimony from a credible source that proves that. It doesn't exist.
Only documentary. But when I find some Katie,,,oops I mean Davdah.. I'll get back to ya
The fact is there is no way for you or me to adequately investigate any theory to debunk what we already know to be true.
Naw.. We will just keep digging until we get some TRuth and satisfaction.
But remember, 911 commision report does not cover Tower 7. and that is a fact.
Starting with the abreviated passenger list by CNN. It stands to reason the list would not include people who were suspected of being the perps. When it happened I'm sure the gov stepped in and took control over what info could be given out. Remember, it wasn't till afterwards we learned what it was all about. From the onset all possibilities had to be considered. To not include specific names of passengers or crew for that matter would be within the scope of national security. Which is what they did.
In a situation like that one thing you don't want to give the enemy is a sense of accomplishment. By not disclosing their names it would at least cause frustration for the next obvious step which would have been a claim of responsibility.
In any terrorist act the two actions that always follows each other are. One, the act. Then the claim by who did it. In most cases they make it a point to martyrize the criminals.
The only myth here is the level of ignorance being transformed into a conspiracy.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
NO CONSPIRACY!!!! The Father Had an Attempt of assignation that the Son Took personally!!!! It Is possible a Personal grievance Was a Driven???? allowing personal revenge to Cloud slightly? Thee Administrations of Past 8 Years or So . Where HATED! by Those of Afar!!!! WHY????? vgjhvgjhvhjvghjhvjh. LOL. Sorry! I Am Just . Maybe I Am TROLL???? As Others Mentioned In Past. Get my Jollies From Ignorance???? Converted Troll??? Found Some Da mn Good Intelligence and People Here??? good Thinkers!!!! .
This message has been edited. Last edited by: MakeItRight!,
USC and Legal, Honest Immigrant Alike Must Fight Against Those That Deceive and Disrupt A Place Of Desirability! All Are Victims of Fraud, Both USC and Honest Immigrant Alike! The bad can and does make it more difficult for the good! Be careful who you blame!!! kami ay nanonood!!!
Originally posted by iperson: I fully agree with Davdah. Those conspiracy theories are hoax, and everything can be explained if you take the time to consider each argument carefully and take it apart, and support it with facts and circumstances. You cannot confuse speculation with factual evidence and let paranoia be the final thesis.
First of all, it does not make sense that American people, however evil the current administration had been, would have devised such an evil attack against its own people. Arianna Huffington writes in "The Right is Wrong", and it is supported by a witness account, that president Bush few hours after the attacks on 9/11 asked his close advisers if this attack could open up the way to the Iraq war. Which was planned before Bush had been elected to the office by neocons like Wolfowitz. The administration started working on the war propaganda on 9/11, but they were not involved in the attack itself. The argument that US government had planned the attacks is weak and doesn't hold water. The US didn't need to make such a strong case for the war with Iraq, or any case for that matter. Hussein as an evil emperor could have sufficed. And second, 9/11 as a link to Iraq was weak from the beginning. Moreover, if you are so interested in circumstances behind the attack, you should examine historical and cultural background behind Bin Laden, and US relationship with Saudi Arabia and the Bin Laden clan. It would be helpful if you read the book "Bin Ladens" (google it). Such claims including one that Bin Laden couldn't have accomplished such a feat on his own is quite ignorant.
IP!!!! Doin a Great Job!!!! Bi n L a den Been Around long!!!! years Of planning!!!! there are Those That Have Planned and Made It Their Very Soul and Agenda To Destroy USA! Many, Many, Years!!!! Very Unlikely They Would Ever Acknowledge Or Respect Any True Delegate!!!! Or Anything That Would Provide More Security Or Stability To USA!!!!
USC and Legal, Honest Immigrant Alike Must Fight Against Those That Deceive and Disrupt A Place Of Desirability! All Are Victims of Fraud, Both USC and Honest Immigrant Alike! The bad can and does make it more difficult for the good! Be careful who you blame!!! kami ay nanonood!!!
As much as there was a personal vendetta against hussain 9-11 was far too elaborate a scheme justify an invasion. Not only that the link is very weak. Wished and hoped for but not well connected.
Had the object been revenge only, once captured that would have signaled the end of the war and beginning of withdraw. Instead, we're still there. A somewhat true purpose is installing a democracy.
My guess. The purpose behind the purpose is to destabilize the oil cartel and break the monopoly. Which may explain the reluctance to drill in our back yard. Our gov folks may be betting on cheaper oil from the region in a short while.
I agree Binladen more or less worked on his own. He had money. The pipeline to which was left open through complacency. With that and a radical religious interpretation coupled with ignorant masses, you have a devoted army.
The moment you capitulate to lawlessness you've lost your civility.
Posts: 8965 | Location: San Diego, or near by. | Registered: 06-08-2007
I trust Arianna Huffington as much as I trust those horse dewormer paste applicators. Easy application, on yourself that is, you end up that that krap all over you no matter what gimmick you try! A rip off!
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And it was, of course, a complete crock. 
It took authorities seven years, in fact, before they were able to bring in Eric Rudolph, the man who actually appears as the kind of soulless cretin that people wanted to believe Richard Jewell to be. Rudolph, a man with reported ties to a white supremacist religion that is anti-***, anti-Semitic and anti-abortion, had managed to evade capture for much of that time by living in survivalist style in the mountains of western North Carolina.
. Where HATED! by Those of Afar!!!! WHY????? vgjhvgjhvhjvghjhvjh. LOL. Sorry! I Am Just 
. Maybe I Am TROLL???? As Others Mentioned In Past. Get my Jollies From Ignorance???? Converted Troll??? Found Some Da mn Good Intelligence and People Here??? good Thinkers!!!! 
.