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Senior Member
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quote: Sabuntium, sorry to tell this but your guess is way off. I don't use enough objectionable adjectives in my posts to be considered in any resepect similar. Not only that I don't believe in general amnesty. I don't believe in selling out our country.
Don't be sorry, but it just looks like the same person plays the chess against oneself. Different moves, different tactics and objectives, yet the spirit of the player is the same. As to GA, McCain and the next Congress will decide on it, perhaps sooner than later. All I see is waves, forces, cycles... physics in short. When you bring emotional aspect you lose clarity of vision. Regards, Sabuntium
Have all the good s.ex you can, in all the ways you can, for as long as ever you can !
-- Sabuntium The Great
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| Posts: 928 | Location: Originally from: Galaxy of Centaurus A (also known as NGC 5128) | Registered: 06-26-2008 | |
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Power Member
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quote: Originally posted by davdah: quote: Hmmm... Moowaaahhh! You're cute! So it's like something new, classified, top-secret employment verification project in the works? In whose backyard, basement, or attic?
I know I am, and what are you? C'mon Rn, where is that old implied quick wit? The Mouhahahaa wasn't used long enough ago to be forgotten. I guess JC should feel flattered he was plagiarized. BTW, its MouHaaHaa with a dark sinister undertone to it. Just for practice, try this
How could "Moowaaahhh!" be governed by spelling or copyright rules? Neither mine nor what you suggested to be the correct version is officially an English word. But anyway, instead of dwelling on some random outbursts of cyber expressions (or ‘adjectives’ being used), why don’t you try to focus on or try to counter the hard facts and real-time data that are being raised? Oh, I know, you can’t. You lack the ability to go beyond your unsupported ‘say-so’ statements and your accusation that I support general amnesty. Once again, I know that you cannot, but I challenge you just the same, prove it.
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"The letter of the law is a sword that killeth; its intent is a spirit that giveth life."
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Power Member
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But you do. In a prior discussion you stated your idea which was amnesty, albeit gradual. Still the same ugly girl in a different dress. I stand by the majority of America that has had enough of our culture, economy, and way of life wrecked by the onslaught. We don't want it. Simple as that. Its isn't just me saying so. If there wasn't a general disgust with it would any DC folks be bothered with any legislation concerning this? No, they would not.
You voted democrat. This country is not worth sneaking into any more.
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| Posts: 5791 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007 | |
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Power Member
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Oh, I know, because you say so once again. Then if you say so, you better check the meaning of 'amnesty' and how it differs from what I said. You would struggle with that alone. Afterwards, prove that I support 'general amnesty' that you accuse me of absent any basis.
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"The letter of the law is a sword that killeth; its intent is a spirit that giveth life."
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Power Member
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Amnesty as it is commonly known is making those illegal, legal. No need to break out Webster and start playing with definitions. That only distracts from the true theme. The options are clear to everyone concerned. That is what it comes down to. Legal or not. And no, it isn't because I say so. Walk outside and ask each person you see. Should the average illegal be given a green card, ever? The majority answer will be a stearn NO. Its been done in polls, TV, radio, and most forms of media. The legislature is not debating this issue because of one lone voice. One times several million voices want this rectified and corrected. The country returned to our rightful status as leader of the free world. Not the defacto host of all parasites. But if you want to challenge that. Here is the result of 2 seconds labor on google. Now my question is this. How do you justify standing in the way of what the people of this country want for their own country? Poll1 poll 2 poll 3 poll4
You voted democrat. This country is not worth sneaking into any more.
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| Posts: 5791 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007 | |
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Power Member
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Simple answer, my friend. Mass deportation is impossible and expensive. Amnesty is a taboo and doesn't deliver the goodies to America in the long run. Status quo is unacceptable, despite the raids, EEVs, and state legislative vigilantism. All of the above taken together don't deliver any reasonable dividends to address, deal with, much less solve, the serious immigration mess that we have nowadays. What do you suggest? Say-so statements are not to be tolerated anymore!
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"The letter of the law is a sword that killeth; its intent is a spirit that giveth life."
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Power Member
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Sorry to interrupt, but the short answer is the people who have been working and paying taxes just like the rest of us should be given a break - some sort of way to become legal (behind the rest). The remainder - as S12 would say, das boot! lol  |
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Power Member
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Oops! He will call that amnesty.
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"The letter of the law is a sword that killeth; its intent is a spirit that giveth life."
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Power Member
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quote: Originally posted by Rough Neighbor:
Oops! He will call that amnesty.
Hey RN! My definition of amnesty is complete forgiveness. If we make these people pay fines and wait in the back of the line, does that equate to the definition? |
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Power Member
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quote: Originally posted by ProudUSC: quote: Originally posted by Rough Neighbor:
Oops! He will call that amnesty.
Hey RN! My definition of amnesty is complete forgiveness. If we make these people pay fines and wait in the back of the line, does that equate to the definition?
Exactly. That's what I told him in another thread: http://discuss.ilw.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/902603441/m/7...10593541#95210593541But what did I get? Being accused as a 'general amnesty' supporter.
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"The letter of the law is a sword that killeth; its intent is a spirit that giveth life."
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Power Member
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quote: Originally posted by Rough Neighbor: quote: Originally posted by ProudUSC: quote: Originally posted by Rough Neighbor:
Oops! He will call that amnesty.
Hey RN! My definition of amnesty is complete forgiveness. If we make these people pay fines and wait in the back of the line, does that equate to the definition?
Exactly. That's what I told him in another thread: http://discuss.ilw.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/902603441/m/7...10593541#95210593541But what did I get? Being accused as a 'general amnesty' supporter.
You have more energy tonight looking up past threads than I, but all the people who called it amnesty last year were so wrong. And, where are we today? Have the ICE raids improved anything? I would have to say no. They're just using these scare tactics to show they are 'doing' something about the situation. Using humans as pawns. . . very pathetic. |
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Power Member
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Proud, that is exactly what she wants. If you recall. It was like pulling teeth but she finally came clean with the truth which is a gradual legalization of just about everyone. Not acceptable to anyone. Especially those out of work. Those who had their wages lowered due to the wholesale slaughter of their standard of living by cheap illegal labor. Tell that plan to those people. I bet you don't walk out of the room. The amount of fines required to make it right is beyond what most could afford. What was spent on welfare, unpaid medical, and unpaid taxes to name a few would send most running for the border. Even then it would not reinstate the losses suffered due to suppressed wages and long term economic damage already done. No, a fine is no way to gage the price of admission. Tell that to the people obeying our laws and waiting their turn. Again, you'll be carried out of the room. Mass deportation is impossible? Says who? You? Status Quo is a no go. About the only thing we agree on. What the states have done is by no means vigilantism. It is the right of each state to protect its borders and its own residence. If anything I'd say they were on the right track. More needs to be done.
You voted democrat. This country is not worth sneaking into any more.
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| Posts: 5791 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007 | |
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Power Member
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If one defines "amnesty" they way have in your post, most people, if given a three option answer would be split. However, in the political context, and more importantly, a legal context, this is not what what is being proposed. Allowing illegals to become legal is not giving them a green card. It is allowing them to work legally. think of it this way, allowing F visa students an EAD while they are in college with very little restrictions on who or where you work. This is what has been proposed. of the four polls your provided, two, worldetdaily and Numbers USA (which is an immigrant, legal and illegal, restriction web site) is biased. The other two, Rasmussen and polling regport, are unbiased. The Rasmussen poll tends not to favor that 62% believe illegal aliens who have been here more than two year should be given a chance even though 69% say illegal aliens should be prosecuted. Interesting poll. On one hand, the poll tends to favor some sort of legalization while on another question tens not to favo legalization. In fact, the report goes at great lengths of compromise between enforcement and some sort of legalization rather than your Draconian approach. The second poll, although a bit old, finds most Americans split on legalization. The question and result as follows: "Would you support or oppose a program giving illegal immigrants now living in the United States the right to live here legally if they pay a fine and meet other requirements?" Favor: 49% Appose: 46% Unsure: 5% After reading the polls from reputable organizations, I guess a slim majority, and even a significant majority, would be in favor of some sort of legalization as well as enforcement. Care to dispute the two polls that contradict your statements?
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." John Adams on Defense of the boston Massacre
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Power Member
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quote: The amount of fines required to make it right is beyond what most could afford.
There should be a criteria. I'm not trying to give our country away to illegals, guys. Just trying to be reasonable considering factors at hand. If the illegals are hard working people paying taxes and Social Security, why should they be given the boot as opposed to all the lazy a.ss Americans who won't do the work and have the benefit of welfare? |
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Power Member
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It depends on how the questions are posed to people. This was demonstrated in Los Angeles a few months ago on a radio show, KFI-640. The idea was to show that a poll can be made to show just about anything depending on what is considered an affirmative answer or not. The illegal alien problem was the issue and the topic of fines was the key element. Many people felt they should be fined. But how it's worded made it appear that people were in favor of letting them stay if they paid a fine. In truth what the person wanted was a fine imposed and deported. Which in fact is what most people do want. I merely grabbed the first four that came up. Regardless, the issue is a hot one for what reason? Why are people upset and the congress looking for answers? What is it about their presence that created this chaos? Are they really doing jobs we don't want? Are they paying taxes and offsetting their direct and indirect costs imposed on society at large? Are they making a significant contribution to crime? It isn't so much them being here. Its what they do while they're here that has people riled up.
You voted democrat. This country is not worth sneaking into any more.
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| Posts: 5791 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007 | |
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Frequent Member
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WhAt oBjEcT Is sErVeD By tHiS CiRcLe oF MiSeRy aNd vIoLeNcE AnD FeAr? It mUsT TeNd tO SoMe eNd, Or eLsE OuR UnIvErSe iS RuLeD By cHaNcE, wHiCh iS UnThInKaBlE. bUt wHaT EnD? tHeRe iS ThE GrEaT StAnDiNg pErEnNiAl pRoBlEm tO WhIcH HuMaN ReAsOn iS As fAr fRoM An aNsWeR As eVeR
Everything comes in circles ....... The old wheel turns, and the same spoke comes up. It's all been done before, and will be again.
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Power Member
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quote: Originally posted by ProudUSC: quote: The amount of fines required to make it right is beyond what most could afford.
There should be a criteria. I'm not trying to give our country away to illegals, guys. Just trying to be reasonable considering factors at hand. If the illegals are hard working people paying taxes and Social Security, why should they be given the boot as opposed to all the lazy a.ss Americans who won't do the work and have the benefit of welfare?
They are not paying taxes. That is part of the problem. Most max out the W-4. No withheld taxes. The SSN belongs to someone else who gets a call from the IRS at the end of the year about unreported income. What about those people? I don't accept the idea that Americans are lazy. Only unwilling to work at the near slave wages employers of illegals pay. And, what do you think will happen to joe illegal when he is legal? Will he still work for less than minimum wage? No, he won't. The employer will fire him. Same thing that happened when Reagan legalized millions in the 80's. That was the one mistake he made. If anyone recalls the big welfare debate around that same time. The amounts spend on welfare exploded. There was a huge debate about kicking welfare queens off the public dol.
You voted democrat. This country is not worth sneaking into any more.
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| Posts: 5791 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007 | |
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Power Member
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quote: Originally posted by davdah: quote: Originally posted by ProudUSC: quote: The amount of fines required to make it right is beyond what most could afford.
There should be a criteria. I'm not tryin
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My suggestion made several weeks ago is the best. Line 'em up, pack 'em up, ship 'em to Africa. Airline business is down, now is the time to rent those planes and swiftly implement my suggestion. Don't make me come back and 