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Power Member
Picture of ProudUSC
Posted Hide Post
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/22/debate.schneider/index.html

Analysis: Clinton likely didn't slow Obama's momentum


Sen. Barack Obama has won 11 straight contests against Sen. Hillary Clinton.


(CNN) -- It was one of Hillary Clinton's last chances to knock rival Barack Obama -- seemingly on a path to the Democratic nomination -- off course.

But throughout the CNN/Univision debate in Austin, Texas, on Thursday night, the New York senator struck a cautious and, at times, conciliatory tone toward Obama, and likely did little to blunt the momentum of a candidate who has won 11 straight contests.

It wasn't quite the love-fest of the CNN debate in Los Angeles, California, three weeks ago, but Clinton repeatedly shied away from challenging her rival, even when the debate's moderators gave her ample opportunities to do so.

Obama emerged relatively unscathed as a result. It was, by all measures, a victory for the Illinois senator given the clear front-runner status he now holds.

But it was by no means a poor performance for Clinton, and she did successfully draw some contrasts with Obama on his health care stance -- an issue in which she holds the upper hand.

Obama's plan could leave many uninsured, and Clinton effectively stressed this point in one of her strongest moments of the debate. She immediately put Obama on the defensive about his own plan and proved she understands this issue through and through. Watch candidates debate health care »

Plus, Clinton clearly ended on a strong note, eloquently responding to the question about a time she had been tested with a reference to her past that drew laughter, and a poignant answer about how her problems pale in comparison to those of average voters.

It was her "Casablanca" moment, reminiscent of the legendary movie's final moment when the protagonist declared, "It doesn't take much to see that the problems of three little people don't amount to a hill of beans in this crazy world."

Clinton also ended her answer with her most conciliatory tone toward Obama to date, in a response that seemed to signal for the first time that she felt she might not win her party's nomination.

"You know, no matter what happens in this contest, I am honored. I am honored to be here with Barack Obama," Clinton said. "I am absolutely honored."

The answer received a standing ovation, and it was certainly a memorable moment -- but it's unclear if it did anything more than harden the support she already has.

Most likely, it won't change the dynamic of this race, though the true effect of it will be determined by the media coverage around it: Should it get replayed over and over on television, it just may have an impact on this race and could stand out as the debate's most striking moment.

Obama had several strong moments as well, especially when he raised the issue of Iraq and his early opposition to it. It's a contrast he repeatedly draws with Clinton, who voted for the Iraq war resolution. When Clinton suggested he lacked the experience to be president, Obama effectively cited his early opposition as evidence his judgment is better than hers.

On the whole, Iraq is an issue Obama always does well discussing, drawing upon his strong rhetorical skills to convey the human toll the war has cost and his reasons for opposing it early on.

But Obama's strongest moments came when he was successful in framing the debate more about style than policy.

Clinton has always been a policy wonk, and has proven on more than one occasion that she is more comfortable than Obama discussing the nuances on a host of issues. And on substance, Clinton had the upper hand Thursday night.

Obama aptly steered the debate away from policy differences and more toward his leadership style -- an approach that has repeatedly proven beneficial to him throughout the campaign.

He stressed several times his ability to work across the aisle and to reach consensus with Republicans. It's an argument that usually plays much better in a general election than during primary season. Plus, it offers a sharp contrast with the leadership approach Clinton emphasizes -- a readiness to fight Republicans every step of the way, if necessary.

But this campaign season seems to have proven even the most partisan Democrats are ready for a different kind of politics, an environment that favors Obama's argument over Clinton's.

(At no point was Obama's effort to paint himself as a consensus builder on clearer display than when he raised his past collaboration with Oklahoma Sen. Tom Coburn, one of the most conservative Republican senators and not the most popular figure in Democratic circles).

Both candidates' strong moments aside, Thursday's debate will likely most be remembered for what did not happen.

With her back against the ropes -- and most likely only one primary loss away from the end of her presidential bid -- Clinton simply chose to throw too few punches to clearly counter Obama's increasing strength.


God Bless America and everyone else!
 
Posts: 5096 | Registered: 02-07-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of ProudUSC
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. B.:
Hi ProudU,

I just checked the Yahoo dashboard and Obama has 1164, Clinton has 1014.

My hubby's candidate (which is officially our household's candidate Wink) has 851 pledged delegates.

It's a tight race for the Democrats! Smile


Sorry, Mrs. B. - I missed this note! Yes, it is a tight race for the Democrats, for sure.

Thanks for providing the update! Take care. Smile


God Bless America and everyone else!
 
Posts: 5096 | Registered: 02-07-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Senior Member
Picture of Mrs. B.
Posted Hide Post
Hi ProudU,

You're welcome.

One more question - if there are more Democrats or Republican delegates in the electoral college (I think it was what Hudson said before) - does this mean that the next US president will be coming from the Dems or Reps, whichever party has the more delegates?

After March 4, granting that Clinton and Obama both come up with equal number of delegates, how long will it take for the superdelegates to decide the party's frontrunner?

Sorry for the numerous questions - might as well get my daily political fix from the forum. Wink

Thanks! Smile


Do all the good you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can.

--John Wesley
 
Posts: 1136 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 12-22-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Senior Member
Picture of Mrs. B.
Posted Hide Post
Hi ProudU,

I have the same problem of trying to keep track also of the posts that I read, I do miss replies every now and then.

Is there a way to mark some of the posts in the forum, just like flagging some emails in yahoo mails?


Do all the good you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can.

--John Wesley
 
Posts: 1136 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 12-22-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of ProudUSC
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. B.:
Hi ProudU,

You're welcome.

One more question - if there are more Democrats or Republican delegates in the electoral college (I think it was what Hudson said before) - does this mean that the next US president will be coming from the Dems or Reps, whichever party has the more delegates?

I will let Hudson answer this question, Mrs. B. The process confuses me as well.

After March 4, granting that Clinton and Obama both come up with equal number of delegates, how long will it take for the superdelegates to decide the party's frontrunner?

I believe this process takes place during the Democratic National Convention that will occur this summer.

Sorry for the numerous questions - might as well get my daily political fix from the forum. Wink

Thanks! Smile


God Bless America and everyone else!
 
Posts: 5096 | Registered: 02-07-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of iperson
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CNN is pro- republican. Bill Shneider is a republican so all the articles on CNN are anti- Clinton.
I don't even read CNN anymore. It's skewed and not objective, as respectable news should be.

Btw, why are republicans even talk about Obama when it's not their own party candidate??? They are making a competition with Hillary as if Obama was THEIR candidate.

Ridiculous. He's nothing remotedly republican and never will be.

Mrs B, why don't you ask me those questions about democratic convention, not republicans on the board (hudson, pusc, davdah, som, s12, etc).
I am a democrat.


I am a proud heart-bleeding tree-hugging latte-sipping urban-dwelling elitist progressive liberal.
 
Posts: 2410 | Registered: 05-18-2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Senior Member
Picture of Mrs. B.
Posted Hide Post
Hi ProudU,

Thanks. Smile

Hi Iperson,

Feel free to chime in. Smile When do you think the superdelegates will choose the frontrunner just in case it gets to a tie on March 4. Can't wait to see who will represent the Dems. Smile

I'm almost certain who the Republican frontrunner will be.


Do all the good you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can.

--John Wesley
 
Posts: 1136 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 12-22-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of ProudUSC
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Mrs B, why don't you ask me those questions about democratic convention, not republicans on the board (hudson, pusc, davdah, som, s12, etc).
I am a democrat.


Mrs. B. has the right to ask the question of anyone she choses. I answered the question correctly. Enough said.


God Bless America and everyone else!
 
Posts: 5096 | Registered: 02-07-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Senior Member
Picture of Mrs. B.
Posted Hide Post
Hi Iperson,

I know that it was just a friendly bet between ProudU and Davdah since the race is tight. There's nothing to discuss with McCain since he's so far in the lead.

It was all in good fun. Smile


Do all the good you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can.

--John Wesley
 
Posts: 1136 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 12-22-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of speed_025
Posted Hide Post
quote:
CNN is pro- republican


very much indeed!

They seem to be backing up Obama ,
It some kind of a media trick.
Come to think of it...
If Hilary win the primary.
There's a 90 % chance for a democrat President.
Because Obama's voters will support Hilary.

But vice versa , If Obama win the primary
Hilary's voters might be divided.. and it's gonna be a close fight bet. Obama and McCain.

I'll still say No to the ReplublicanS!

GO DEMOCRATS! clap
 
Posts: 1276 | Registered: 01-22-2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of iperson
Posted Hide Post
Awww... Mrs B. you are cute.
Let me then explain this sort of confusing process for you electing the president in this country.
Mr. McCain isn't the frontrunner or in the lead. Right this moment there are two seperate races for the nomination to both- the democrat and republican party. Both are independant of each other, so there is no competition between the republican and democrat candidates, as of this moment.
So McCain is not in the lead, and -personal opinion here: he will never be.
Whether sen. Clinton, or sen. Obama win the nomination, mr. MC Cain has no chance for the white house this year, nor ever.

Now. The media are confusing voters saying that Obama is in the lead, which is only partly true, but it doesn't determine him a winner, yet.
Sen. Clinton was in the lead for a long time, and yet nobody asked sen. Obama to concede, as they are hoping sen. Clinton should.
Well, she won't. She will go right to the summer convention in Denver where superdelegates will cast their votes and decide the nominee for Democratic party.
The reason is none of the candidates are going to clinch the required amount of votes for the nomination, which is 2025. It is mathematically impossible.
Thus so, it is wrong to assume that Obama already has the nomination.
Between now and the summer a lot can happen.
I hope this explains the situation a little bit Mrs B. Smile


I am a proud heart-bleeding tree-hugging latte-sipping urban-dwelling elitist progressive liberal.
 
Posts: 2410 | Registered: 05-18-2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Senior Member
Picture of Mrs. B.
Posted Hide Post
Thanks Iperson - I do am following the news and am going by the numbers there, specifically the political dashboard. I do have read that Texas is one of Clinton's strong area so I guess we'll wait and see.


Do all the good you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can.

--John Wesley
 
Posts: 1136 | Location: Georgia | Registered: 12-22-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of iperson
Posted Hide Post
Here is what the numbers say Mrs B:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08_9mA3YdXo&eurl

Watch this video, it explains that the race will go on till Denver.

Speed, lol.

Go Dems!!! Fire all Reps!!!


I am a proud heart-bleeding tree-hugging latte-sipping urban-dwelling elitist progressive liberal.
 
Posts: 2410 | Registered: 05-18-2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of davdah
Posted Hide Post
Say no to Republicans and you say yes to higher taxes, more white house scandals, international embarrassment, and probably terrorism within our borders.



Vote Republican and this country will still be worth sneaking into.
 
Posts: 3722 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of speed_025
Posted Hide Post
You're very funny Davdah what you just said
applies to the Republicans hehehehe

I say it again

gun-bandanaNO TO THE REPLUBLICANS!!
 
Posts: 1276 | Registered: 01-22-2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of iperson
Posted Hide Post
Lol you are so dumb David. I hope everyone sees that.

Now, let me ask a question. Yes, I don't know everything.
Is this possible for a republican to vote in democratic race? Isn't it against the rules? If not, it should be. If you are a registered republican, you should only be allowed to vote in republican primaries.
I think I'll pose this problem for consideration at the democratic convention (hope to go to one). Or when I'm in Washington next month for two weeks (March 16-31st). We're going there on business with my DH, and maybe I'll get to talk to someone about it.

Big Grin


I am a proud heart-bleeding tree-hugging latte-sipping urban-dwelling elitist progressive liberal.
 
Posts: 2410 | Registered: 05-18-2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of iperson
Posted Hide Post
Lol speed, maybe it's time to change my signature too.

gun-bandana NO TO THE REPUBLICANS!!!


I am a proud heart-bleeding tree-hugging latte-sipping urban-dwelling elitist progressive liberal.
 
Posts: 2410 | Registered: 05-18-2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of davdah
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Have you looked at the tax tables from when the Dems where in office compared to now? Look up 1999 and 2007. Check your own income. The proof is undeniable. The attack was planned out during a Democrat's tenure. The scandals that Bill caused made us look like fools. I would rather be seen as a bit of a bully than an idiot any day of the week.

If your believing all the promises being made Just remember, they always make the same promises. Have they ever kept them? What do those promises consist of? Give away everything. Free this, free that. But no one bothers to mention who is going to pay for it. Why?, cause it isn't free. Nothing is. Look at what has happened. Under republican leadership we have lower taxes, a safer country, and a decent economy. Go back a dew decades and look at what happened under Carter, Reagan, Clinton, Bush. Can you honestly say it was better when a Democrat was running things? Be honest, you can't.

The only justification to vote Democrat is your hoping to get some of those freebies they are promising. You'll be dissapointed. But worse, what does that say about your own character?



Vote Republican and this country will still be worth sneaking into.
 
Posts: 3722 | Location: San Antonio TX | Registered: 06-08-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Power Member
Picture of ProudUSC
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Is this possible for a republican to vote in democratic race? Isn't it against the rules? If not, it should be. If you are a registered republican, you should only be allowed to vote in republican primaries.


You are supposed to vote for your registered party during the primaries (if your state requires you to align to a party). In the general election, you can vote for your party of choice regardless of how you are registered.
Isn't Democracy wonderful?


God Bless America and everyone else!
 
Posts: 5096 | Registered: 02-07-2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post