Despite fences, immigrants still broach U.S. border

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080303/lf_nm/usa_border_dc_2

"Local rancher John Ladd said some 300 to 400 illegal immigrants continue to clamber over the new steel barrier flanking the southern reach of his farm for some 10 miles (16 km) each day, as an effective combination of technologies and manpower remains elusive. "It's so easy to climb that I've seen two women that were pregnant, I've seen several women in their sixties and all kinds of kids between five and ten years old climb over it," Ladd said, as he leaned on a section of the steel mesh fence that stretches like a rusted veil westward toward the rugged Huachuca Mountains. "They're getting some help, but when you put it in perspective, its pretty amazing to have a nine-month pregnant woman climbing over that son of a gun, and thinking that this is going to be the answer to solve our immigration problem."" Reuters, Mar. 2, 2008.

That stretch of fence is the old micky mouse version. What was said about the new one,..

While they are controversial -- some border landowners resent what they see as unwelcome government intrusion and some conservationists argue it disrupts wildlife flows -- border police say this stretch of new fencing has been highly effective.

.....It has been a massive success. It has allowed our agents to gain control over the area and acted as a deterrent for people thinking of crossing," said Jeremy Schappell, a spokesman for the Border Patrol's Yuma sector, which includes San Luis. .....

Just like any other issues, the Border Fence has two sides - pro and con. May this thread serve as a neutral ground to accommodate both views.

Hi,

Border Fence, CIR, etc. are some of the many phrases we hear circulating around.

It will be helpful if the senior members can give us a short history/synopsis of the attempts at immigration reform here in the US, leading to Border Fence (I'm assuming that this is the latest act/proposal/law (???) that is in effect now?)

When I came here, what I know is that Pres. Bush's bill was rejected. And that right now, there is nothing that replaced it. (?)

Border Insecurity

"Only by bringing people onto the books and being realistic about the supply of visas, letting people in through ports of entry, instead of chasing them across the desert, will the country restore sanity and order to this broken system." New York Times Editorial, Mar. 4, 2008.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/opinion/04tue1.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

My point of view on the border fence is pretty realistic. I believe with today's technology it is not possible to build a fence that will prevent border jumpers.
Neither a physical wall built using bricks, and wire will deter cunning criminals and trafficers from finding a way to cross the border. Nor any computerized system using sensors, cameras, etc. is able to stop moving targets whether those are coyotees, deer, or humans, and distiniguish between them, not mentioning the time lapse between detection and sending the guards, which make it unrealistic to accomplish.

Isolation from the world and its problems, like many republicans want, is unreasonable and the broken border proves the point.

Landowners a challenge for border fence deadline

"Government auditors warned Congress this week that the Department of Homeland Security will be "challenged" to complete 670 miles of border fencing by a mandated December deadline, since scores of Texas landowners still refuse to allow surveyors on their property." Houston Chronicle, Mar. 7, 2008.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5602956.html

Judge makes landmark decision on border fence

"After a one-month deliberation, U.S. District Judge Andrew S. Hanen has issued the most significant decision in the border fence's short judicial history. In a case against Eloisa Tamez, who owns property along the barrier's proposed path in El Calaboz, Hanen found that the federal government is authorized by the federal Declaration of Taking Act to condemn Tamez's land. But according to the ruling, negotiations must take place between the landowner and the U.S. Department of Homeland Security before property is seized." Brownsville Herald, Mar. 7, 2008.

http://www.themonitor.com/articles/tamez_9724___article.html/court_land.html

Lone Star

Tommy Lee Jones is a man of few words—but when he talks about movies, morality, and the "madness" of immigration politics, a few words can say a lot.

by Richard Bradley
March/April 2008

""The idea of a fence between El Paso and Brownsville bears all the credibility and seriousness of flying saucers from Mars or leprechauns. Or any manner of malicious, paranoid superstition. ... It’s very destructive. Very, very destructive. And it’s the perfectly wrong thing to do. First of all, it won’t work. You can’t build a fence that I cannot get over, through, or under if I want to go to Mexico. In that [border] country, you cannot do it. It’s a complete folly. Ecologically, it’s a complete disaster, and sociologically, it’s a complete disaster. It’s an act of fascist madness." 02138 magazine, March/April 2008."

http://www.02138mag.com/magazine/article/2471-3.html

["TechnoPatriots" scan border from afar by video]

Amateurs use video cameras to watch the border for illegals

By ARTHUR H. ROTSTEIN

""At least a couple of times a week, Ernie Kubr gets off the night shift and fires up his computer at his home in Nebraska so that he can watch for illegal immigrants trying to slip across the Arizona desert 1,400 miles away." AP, Apr. 18, 2008."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j6HRUe6y9DazHXJB26PKbmTmpobQD904F6200

Feds Scrap $20 Million 'Virtual Fence'

By ARTHUR H. ROTSTEIN,AP
Posted: 2008-04-23 12:28:22
Tucson, Ariz. (April 24)

- The government is scrapping a $20 million prototype of its highly touted "virtual fence" on the Arizona-Mexico border because the system is failing to adequately alert border patrol agents to illegal crossings, officials said.

Along the Border1 of 4 This 98-foot tower, outfitted with radar, sensors and sophisticated cameras, is part of the "virtual fence" that was being used to detect illegal immigrants along a 28-mile segment of the Arizona-Mexico border. The $20 million test system has been cancelled because it doesn't give authorities enough notice of illegal crossings, officials said.
The move comes just two months after Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff announced his approval of the fence built by The Boeing Co. The fence consists of nine electronic surveillance towers along a 28-mile section of border southwest of Tucson.

Boeing is to replace the so-called Project 28 prototype with a series of towers equipped with communications systems, new cameras and new radar capability, officials said.

Less than a week after Chertoff accepted Project 28 on Feb. 22, the Government Accountability Office told Congress it "did not fully meet user needs and the project's design will not be used as the basis for future" developments.

A glaring shortcoming of the project was the time lag between the electronic detection of movement along the border and the transmission of a camera image to agents patrolling the area, the GAO reported.

Although the fence continues to operate, it hasn't come close to meeting the Border Patrol's goals, said Kelly Good, deputy director of the Secure Border Initiative program office in Washington.

"Probably not to the level that Border Patrol agents on the ground thought that they were going to get. So it didn't meet their expectations."

The Border Patrol had little input in designing the prototype but will have more say in the final version, officials said.

Agents began using the virtual fence last December, and the towers have resulted in more than 3,000 apprehensions since, said Greg Giddens, executive director of the SBI program office in Washington.

But that's just a fraction of the several hundred illegal immigrants believed to cross the border daily near southwest of Tucson.

The virtual fence is part of a national plan to use physical barriers and high-tech detection capabilities to secure the Mexican border - and eventually the Canadian boundary.

Boeing was awarded an $860 million contract to provide the technology, physical fences and vehicle barriers.

"Boeing has delivered a system that the Border Patrol currently is operating 24 hours a day," Boeing spokeswoman Deborah Bosick said. She declined further comment.

Project 28 was not intended to be the final, state-of-the-art system for catching illegal immigrants, Giddens said. "I think some people understood that and some didn't. We didn't communicate that well."

The Wall of Hate

""Muro del Odio, Wall of Hate, is one name border residents have given to the forbidding barricade the Department of Homeland Security plans to build in Texas communities like Presidio, where residents rely on their Mexican sister, Ojinaga, for commerce and company. Current staff writer and investigative journalist Greg Harman is traveling along the course of the Rio Grande, visiting with community activists, ranchers, cowboys, and elected officials about their fears, hopes, and resistencia." San Antonio Current."

http://www.murodelodio.com/

Build bridges, not walls

""There are those who believe that we North Americans can only hope to resolve this issue by building a wall. I came to Mexico to say, that we don't need to build walls, we need to build bridges." Office of the Mayor, City of Los Angeles, ANTONIO R. VILLARAIGOSA, “Bridges not Walls” - An Address to the United States-Mexico Chamber of Commerce, May 3, 2007."

http://www.bibdaily.com/pdfs/Villaraigosa%20bridges%20not%20walls%205-3-08.pdf


County approves measure that opposes border wall

""The [El Paso] county formally opposed the construction of a border wall in a resolution approved by Commissioners Court on Monday. In a 3-1 vote, the court approved the resolution that calls for solutions to the illegal immigration problem including stopping the construction of the wall and recognizing that local law enforcement officials should not enforce federal immigration law." El Paso Times, May 6, 2008."

http://www.elpasotimes.com/news/ci_9165292


Mexican Smugglers Take to Sea to Cross into U.S.

"NPR, May 7, 2008: "U.S. Customs and Border Patrol agents in San Diego are seeing an increase in smuggling by sea. Improvements in border security on land have pushed immigrant and drug smugglers offshore. During the past few months, dozens of small boats have been found on the beaches near the border. Now federal agents are responding.""

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=90245832

Why a praying mantice? I like your other one better. Maybe a little more of it would have been nice.

There is a way, build a steel wall and have an electric current running with the 10,000 voltage power. The moment any illegal immigrant touches it, they will be dead.

This solves the fencing issue.

It didn't work in Jurasic Park. I don't know that it would work here either. (lol).

What needs to be done is stop the reason they come here. Cut off the jobs and they will leave.

quote:

Originally posted by davdah:
Why a praying mantice? I like your other one better. Maybe a little more of it would have been nice.

One day, she'll return. Depends on climate. Good for praying mantis this time.

quote:

Originally posted by davdah:
It didn't work in Jurasic Park. I don't know that it would work here either. (lol).

So Davdah are you saying all these illegal immigrants are animal...lol. I like that.

Not a good comparison since most of the people in that movie ended up as snacks. But it was kind of nice seeing a lawyer get his.

"A remarkable phone call from a 12-yr old boy to Houston radio station KSBJ FM 89.3. So profound, the station has it posted on their website. Click below to listen to it. It's short."

http://youtube.com/watch?v=zCdZwitrNoY