http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18814416/

That could be a dead cat. Didn't Bush and his warlords claim that Osama Bin Laden was dead? The guy is still very much alive in Pakistan. Bush and his bunch of idiots are liars!

dead dog fits US soldiers better though.

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Originally posted by manali:
dead dog fits US soldiers better though.

Another accident waiting to happen!

If it happens, may you be among them.

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Originally posted by ProudUSC:

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Originally posted by manali:
dead dog fits US soldiers better though.

Another accident waiting to happen!

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Originally posted by macyuhoo:
That could be a dead cat. Didn't Bush and his warlords claim that Osama Bin Laden was dead? The guy is still very much alive in Pakistan. Bush and his bunch of idiots are liars!

Bush never claimed OBL dead. they did claim he might be injured or fatally wounded, but that was always met with suspicion.

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Originally posted by manali:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18814416/

The warrior doesn't care if he's called a beast or a dog; the main thing is winning.
Asakura Norikage (Soteki) (1474-1552)

Check the past media news, Mr. Rock Hudson. Bush and his gang categorically said OBL was dead. Don't twist the news like these i d i o t s do.

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Originally posted by Hudson:

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Originally posted by macyuhoo:
That could be a dead cat. Didn't Bush and his warlords claim that Osama Bin Laden was dead? The guy is still very much alive in Pakistan. Bush and his bunch of idiots are liars!

Bush never claimed OBL dead. they did claim he might be injured or fatally wounded, but that was always met with suspicion.

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Originally posted by macyuhoo:
Check the past media news, Mr. Rock Hudson. Bush and his gang categorically said OBL was dead. Don't twist the news like these i d i o t s do.

I did. From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osama_bin_Laden#April_2005
"April 2005

The Sydney Morning Herald stated "Dr Clive Williams, director of terrorism studies at the Australian National University, says documents provided by an Indian colleague suggested bin Laden died of massive organ failure in April last year...'It's hard to prove or disprove these things because there hasn't really been anything that allows you to make a judgment one way or the other', Dr. Williams said."
AND
On September 23, 2006 the French newspaper L'Est Républicain quoted a report from the French secret service (DGSE) stating that Osama bin Laden had died in Pakistan on August 23, 2006 after contracting a case of typhoid fever that paralyzed his lower limbs. According to the newspaper, Saudi security services first heard of bin Laden's alleged death on September 4, 2006. The alleged death was reported by the Saudi Arabian secret service to its government, which reported it to the French secret service. The French defense minister Michèle Alliot-Marie expressed her regret that the report had been published while French President Jacques Chirac declared that bin Laden's death had not been confirmed. American authorities also cannot confirm reports of bin Laden's death,[94] with Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice saying only, "No comment, and no knowledge."[95] Later, CNN's Nic Robertson said that he had received confirmation from an anonymous Saudi source that the Saudi intelligence community has known for a while that bin Laden has a water-borne illness, but that he had heard no reports that it was specifically typhoid or that he had died"

Note that Sec of State Ms Rice and President Bush stated they cannot confirm the report.

Good reasearch but that doesn't take away Bush's guilt for jumping into the circus saying OBL was dead. After all, wasn't he the one who said there was WMD in Iraq based on what he was told?

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Originally posted by macyuhoo:
Good reasearch but that doesn't take away Bush's guilt for jumping into the circus saying OBL was dead. After all, wasn't he the one who said there was WMD in Iraq based on what he was told?

And yet you have not provided one nuespaper article to verify your claim, Macy.

Wake up! Bush's statements were all over the print and broadcast media. His top aides and the intelligence agencies also admitted the mistake. You're the only one who remains blind in all of these!

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Originally posted by Hudson:

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Originally posted by macyuhoo:
Good reasearch but that doesn't take away Bush's guilt for jumping into the circus saying OBL was dead. After all, wasn't he the one who said there was WMD in Iraq based on what he was told?

And yet you have not provided one nuespaper article to verify your claim, Macy.

Since the shock-and-awe invasion of Iraq began in March 2003, that country's explosive unraveling has never left the news or long been off the front page. Yet the fallout beyond its borders from the destruction, disintegration, and ethnic mayhem in Iraq has almost avoided notice. And yet with -- according to United Nations estimates -- approximately 50,000 Iraqis fleeing their country each month (and untold numbers of others being displaced internally), Iraq is producing one of the -- if not the -- most severe refugee crisis on the planet, a crisis without a name and without significant attention.

Let's start with the numbers, inadequate as they are. The latest UN figures concerning the refugee crisis in Iraq indicate that between 1-1.2 million Iraqis have fled across the border into Syria; about 750,000 have crossed into Jordan (increasing its modest population of 5.5 million by 14%); at least another 150,000 have made it to Lebanon; over 150,000 have emigrated to Egypt; and -- these figures are the trickiest of all -- over 1.9 million are now estimated to have been internally displaced by civil war and sectarian cleansing within Iraq. These numbers are staggering in a population estimated in the pre-invasion years at only 26 million. At a bare minimum, in other words, at least one out of every seven Iraqis has had to flee his or her home due to the violence and chaos set off by the Bush administration's invasion and occupation of Iraq.

Yet, as even the UN officials on the scene admit, these are undoubtedly low-end estimates. "We rely heavily on the official numbers given to us by the Syrian government concerning the Iraqi refugees coming here," Sybella Wilkes, the regional public information officer for the UNHCR told me. According to Wilkes, the Syrian government, using tallies taken from its southern border posts, privately estimates the number to be closer to 1.4-1.5 million Iraqis in Syria. The UNHCR operation here, desperately under-funded and short of staff, does not have people on the border tallying numbers and has no way to check on the real magnitude of the disaster underway. UNHCR's budget for Iraqis in Syria in 2006 was a bare $700,000, less than one dollar per refugee crossing the border.

Assistant Secretary of State Ellen Sauerbrey told a Senate hearing in January 2007 that the United States had admitted 466 Iraqi refugees since 2003.

Bombed churches, a beheaded clergyman, and the massacre of 13 Christian women and girls, because they didn’t wear the traditional Islamic veils. In the last month, these are just the most extreme acts of violence carried out against Christians across Iraq. The UN High Commission for Refugees reports that Christians comprise 44% of Iraqi refugees, although only 4% of the overall population is Christian. They were tolerated under the secular regime of Saddam Hussein, who even made one of them, Tariq Aziz, his deputy. But as the war has radicalised Islamic sensibilities, Christians have seen their total numbers slump from 1.2 million before the US-led invasion of March 2003 to about 600,000 today.

An exodus to the neighbouring countries of Syria, Jordan and Turkey has left behind closed parishes, seminaries and convents. As a small minority without a militia of their own, Iraqi Christians have been persecuted by both Shi’a and Sunni Muslim militias, and also by criminal gangs. “It was bad in Iraq under the old regime,” says James Isho, whose family fled Baghdad two years ago after the church next door to their house in the Dora district was bombed. “Now it’s even worse.”

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Originally posted by Malinsky:
... The UN High Commission for Refugees reports that Christians comprise 44% of Iraqi refugees, although only 4% of the overall population is Christian. They were tolerated under the secular regime of Saddam Hussein, who even made one of them, Tariq Aziz, his deputy. But as the war has radicalised Islamic sensibilities, Christians have seen their total numbers slump from 1.2 million before the US-led invasion of March 2003 to about 600,000 today.

An exodus to the neighbouring countries of Syria, Jordan and Turkey has left behind closed parishes, seminaries and convents. As a small minority without a militia of their own, Iraqi Christians have been persecuted by both Shi’a and Sunni Muslim militias, and also by criminal gangs. “It was bad in Iraq under the old regime,” says James Isho, whose family fled Baghdad two years ago after the church next door to their house in the Dora district was bombed. “Now it’s even worse.”

I'm not a Saddam fan, but I believe now that he should be posthumously (looking at Iraq before and after US invasion) hailed for: holding Iraq together as one piece; reigning in Islamic militants across sectarian divide; maintaining loss of lives to the barest "minimum" hence less grieving Iraqi and American families (especially US military families); keeping the US in high esteem by the world and the Middle East especially sympathetic towards us in the aftermath of 9/11 and beyond; and lastly, by leaving us alone, richer, and safer.

And what about all of his 'fellow' countrymen who died under his power? He was killing his own people! He ordered the murders of his daughter's husbands! Please don't generalize this situation and find another excuse for our not being there! Maybe we can't save the world, but at least we are doing our best to rid the world of tyrants! Look beyond what the media is telling you, Rough Neighbor - there's more than meets the eye. It's not as easy as your post suggests.

So what if he killed his own people? What business do we Americans have to invade their country and kill them? Why not China? China kill and execute their own people; but does Uncle Sam do anything? Nah. It's double standard.

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Originally posted by ProudUSC:
And what about all of his 'fellow' countrymen who died under his power? He was killing his own people! He ordered the murders of his daughter's husbands! Please don't generalize this situation and find another excuse for our not being there! Maybe we can't save the world, but at least we are doing our best to rid the world of tyrants! Look beyond what the media is telling you, Rough Neighbor - there's more than meets the eye. It's not as easy as your post suggests.

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Originally posted by macyuhoo:
So what if he killed his own people? What business do we Americans have to invade their country and kill them? Why not China? China kill and execute their own people; but does Uncle Sam do anything? Nah. It's double standard.

quote:

Originally posted by ProudUSC:
And what about all of his 'fellow' countrymen who died under his power? He was killing his own people! He ordered the murders of his daughter's husbands! Please don't generalize this situation and find another excuse for our not being there! Maybe we can't save the world, but at least we are doing our best to rid the world of tyrants! Look beyond what the media is telling you, Rough Neighbor - there's more than meets the eye. It's not as easy as your post suggests.

I'm not going to get into this with you, macyuhoo. We all have our opinions - you heard mine and I respect yours. Let's leave it at that and move on. I'd love to have a debate with you, but do not want to bog this board down with issues that aren't related to immigration. So - let's agree to disagree and allow the posters to continue without further interruption on our part.

quote:

Originally posted by ProudUSC:
And what about all of his 'fellow' countrymen who died under his power? He was killing his own people! He ordered the murders of his daughter's husbands! Please don't generalize this situation and find another excuse for our not being there! Maybe we can't save the world, but at least we are doing our best to rid the world of tyrants! Look beyond what the media is telling you, Rough Neighbor - there's more than meets the eye. It's not as easy as your post suggests.

Ow! Now he killed his own people. Why, because the WMD claim was a hoax? that the Saddam-Al Qaeda link was never proven? Go ahead, talk as if we cared about Iraqi lives. Look who are being killed everyday today (by whom or due to whose missteps?), by a thousand fold. One less tyrant against one hell of a mess? Do we care that much about the genocide in Sudan? Now it's me and the media, huh? Well, with due respect to you, let me say, enough of your own source (I didn't say Karl Rove).

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Rough Neighbor,

Fellow USC, you're not actually too bad. We clash in opinion but I do respect what you say. You're a proud USC but I'm not. I was born in this country but sometimes I feel like giving up my citizenship because of our foreign policies...our bullyinh tactics and behavior in this world. When I say we have a double standard, it is. Why are we scared of China and North Korea? We invaded Iraq and almost did the same to Iran only through false and inacurrate intelligence reports. But here's North Korea openly challenging America and her allies. They say "Come and get us". We did nothing. They fired missiles violating international laws but we did nothing. China is the world's worst violation of human rights, and we do nothing. Now if a smaller and weaker nation is not so friendly with Uncle Sam, we immediately jump on her. Is it fair?

quote:

Originally posted by ProudUSC:

quote:

Originally posted by macyuhoo:
So what if he killed his own people? What business do we Americans have to invade their country and kill them? Why not China? China kill and execute their own people; but does Uncle Sam do anything? Nah. It's double standard.

quote:

Originally posted by ProudUSC:
And what about all of his 'fellow' countrymen who died under his power? He was killing his own people! He ordered the murders of his daughter's husbands! Please don't generalize this situation and find another excuse for our not being there! Maybe we can't save the world, but at least we are doing our best to rid the world of tyrants! Look beyond what the media is telling you, Rough Neighbor - there's more than meets the eye. It's not as easy as your post suggests.

I'm not going to get into this with you, macyuhoo. We all have our opinions - you heard mine and I respect yours. Let's leave it at that and move on. I'd love to have a debate with you, but do not want to bog this board down with issues that aren't related to immigration. So - let's agree to disagree and allow the posters to continue without further interruption on our part.