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Fact-Checking Dobbs: CNN Anchor Lou Dobbs Challenged on Immigration Issues In a wide-ranging interview, CNN anchor Lou Dobbs joins Democracy Now! for the hour to discuss:
His claim that a “third of our prison population†are illegal aliens (according to the Justice Department about 6 percent of the state and federal prison population are non-citizens) Why white supremacists have appeared on Lou Dobbs Tonight without disclosure over their ties to hate groups His show’s reporting on leprosy and immigration. A 2005 report on Lou Dobbs Tonight claimed there had been 7,000 new cases of leprosy in the U.S. over the past three years. In fact, there have been 7,000 cases reported over the past 30 years And more… [includes rush transcript] Help
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Lou Dobbs, anchor and managing editor of CNN’s Lou Dobbs Tonight. His latest book is “Independents Day: Awakening the American Spirit.â€
Rush Transcript This transcript is available free of charge. However, donations help us provide closed captioning for the deaf and hard of hearing on our TV broadcast. Thank you for your generous contribution. Donate - $25, $50, $100, More...
JUAN GONZA***: “CNN anchor Lou Dobbs may be the most important person in the 2008 presidential election aside from the candidates themselves.†That’s the opening line of a recent column by Christopher Gacek on the website Politico. Gacek goes on to write, “The bundle of concerns that Dobbs and his audience have about globalization, trade, diminished American sovereignty and immigration will be ignored by politicians at their own peril.â€
As anchorman and managing editor of the show Lou Dobbs Tonight, Dobbs has used his nightly program on CNN to help make immigration one of the most discussed issues of the 2008 campaign. Dobbs describes himself as an independent populist. He titled his latest book Independents Day: Awakening the American Spirit. His previous book was titled War on the Middle Class: How the Government, Big Business, and Special Interest Groups Are Waging War on the American Dream and How to Fight Back.
AMY GOODMAN: Lou Dobbs also has his detractors, especially when it comes to immigration. He has been called the most influential spokesperson for the anti-immigration movement, and he’s been accused of being a fearmonger who vilifies immigrants and promotes xenophobia.
But Lou Dobbs’s message has struck a chord with many viewers. Lou Dobbs Tonight is the second-most-watched program on CNN, and there’s even talk that Dobbs might make a possible run for the White House. Wall Street Journal columnist John Fund reported last month friends of Dobbs say he’s seriously contemplating running for president as an independent.
Lou Dobbs joins us today in our firehouse studio for the hour. Welcome to Democracy Now!
LOU DOBBS: Great to be with you.
AMY GOODMAN: Are you running?
LOU DOBBS: Absolutely not. It’s the last thing I could imagine. If I were a candidate, I can assure both of you that I would be the candidate of last resort in this country. That’s about 300 million people in line ahead of me.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, you’ve written the book Independents Day. That’s with a “ts†at the end of “Independents.â€
LOU DOBBS: Right.
AMY GOODMAN: What is the main thesis of this book?
LOU DOBBS: The main thesis is that both political parties—the Republican Party, Democratic Party—have failed the American people, have, rather than held up our central fundamental national values as the standard to which all of our public policies should repair, has submerged them in trivia, wedge issues, and partisan blather and nonsense that is ultimately destructive to the American dream.
AMY GOODMAN: What do you think are the most important issues today?
LOU DOBBS: The most important issue in this country today is representation of the American people in Washington, D.C., which is being denied right now by corporate America, special interest, group and identity politics that are submerging the will of the majority in this country. The fundamental tenet of any democracy is representation of the will of the majority, and that is being denied through elitists in both business and government and politics. And we have to fundamentally examine where we are and where we want to be going over the course of this next century. And that is not happening, not in the presidential campaigns of both parties. It’s not happening in Washington, D.C., even though we have a government in which the Democratic Party is leading the Congress, and the Republican Party, the White House.
JUAN GONZA***: Now, Lou, you’ve been well known for years now, especially dealing with the issue of American corporations exporting jobs and criticizing that whole process of exporting American jobs overseas.
LOU DOBBS: Sure.
JUAN GONZA***: And your—but also the criticism of it, that as I’ve seen it as, oftentimes does not deal with the impact so much of what this globalization on those countries themselves. In other words, you criticize NAFTA for sending so many jobs overseas, but not with the impact so much that it’s having on Mexico and on these other countries that are the other end of this free trade.
LOU DOBBS: Juan, that may be because I’m a television journalist, limited in my intellect, as well as my time.
JUAN GONZA***: Well, on this show, we don’t have commercials, so we have a lot of time to get into the issues.
LOU DOBBS: The reality is that, of course, NAFTA is, in my judgment, at least deleterious to the interests of the Mexican people and to the state of Mexico. One only has to look at the empty villages in particularly southern Mexico to examine the impact of the agricultural policies within NAFTA. One only has to look at the maquiladoras across northern Mexico to see the impact on a society that is already 50% impoverished, education levels still where they were thirty years ago in Mexico.
But my perspective is an American one. And I won’t presume to speak for Mexico, as Felipe Calderon does presume to speak to the United States for Americans on American policy. The reality is that NAFTA doesn’t work for this country. It doesn’t work for Mexico.
But I am not one of those people—as Amy was talking about, my detractors. The suggestion I’m anti-immigrant, for example, is absurd. I would support an increase in lawful immigration and have said so repeatedly and have no problem whatsoever with current levels of immigration, which, by the way, are the highest levels of immigration in the world—in fact, more than the rest of the world combined. We bring in more than two million people. But the issue is one that the United States does not have a foreign policy toward Mexico. We’re paternalistic and condescending toward Mexico in our dealings with Mexico, both corporately and politically. And it’s time for that to change.
AMY GOODMAN: In the beginning of the broadcast, we played a clip—
LOU DOBBS: Sure.
AMY GOODMAN: —of you talking about various concerns that you have around immigrants.
LOU DOBBS: Sure.
AMY GOODMAN: The last part of that clip—and maybe we can play it again—
LOU DOBBS: Illegal immigrants, if I may, Amy.
AMY GOODMAN: Illegal immigrants.
LOU DOBBS: Only illegal immigrants.
AMY GOODMAN: Maybe we can play a last part of this clip that we played, just to go through it again. We’ll see if our folks have that clip ready. And this is the clip that we played in the billboard. It’s—
LOU DOBBS: Well, I can recall what was said if it’s at all helpful. I said that according to a study—I didn’t use the attribution, but according to a study that Jorge Borjas at Harvard University had completed, that the cost of excess immigration into this country amounts to $200 billion a year in wages, that the cost of incarceration, medical care, social services approximates $50 billion in this country per year. And the reality is that about a third of the crimes that are of those in state prisons—federal prisons, excuse me, federal prisons, are—I’m sorry.
AMY GOODMAN: Are…?
LOU DOBBS: Are those who are in this country illegally.
AMY GOODMAN: Let’s play it.
LOU DOBBS: Sure.
AMY GOODMAN: And then let’s talk about it.
LOU DOBBS: Let’s say the number is eleven million, although some studies put the number as high as twenty million illegal aliens in this country. That not only amounts to a shift of six to ten congressional seats among the states based on the population of illegal immigration. The fact is, those illegal aliens are costing our economy $200 billion in depressed wages for working Americans. It is costing $50 billion a year in social and medical costs. And it’s costing us, no one knows precisely how much, to incarcerate what is about a third of our prison population who are illegal aliens.
AMY GOODMAN: So, Lou, you said a third of the prison population are illegal aliens.
LOU DOBBS: Right.
AMY GOODMAN: The fact is, it’s something like 6% of prisoners in this country are non-citizens, not even illegal, just non-citizens.
LOU DOBBS: Right.
AMY GOODMAN: And then a percentage of that would not be documented.
LOU DOBBS: Well, it’s actually—I think it’s 26% in federal prison.
AMY GOODMAN: But you said of all prisoners.
LOU DOBBS: I said about—yes, but I—and I misspoke, without question. I was referring to federal prisoners.
AMY GOODMAN: But you didn’t say that, and so it leaves people with the impression—
LOU DOBBS: Well, I didn’t, but then I just explained it to you.
AMY GOODMAN: But you have a very large audience on CNN.
LOU DOBBS: I have a very large audience and a very bright audience.
AMY GOODMAN: And you told them that a third of the population of this country are illegal immigrants. 6% , which is under the population of immigrants—
LOU DOBBS: 6% , right.
AMY GOODMAN: —in this country, of prisoners—
LOU DOBBS: In state prisons.
AMY GOODMAN: —are immigrants.
LOU DOBBS: In state prisons. In state prisons.
AMY GOODMAN: No, 6% overall are immigrants. You said 30% are illegal.
LOU DOBBS: Well, I think we’ve established—we could sit here and say this all day, Amy. The fact is, the number is 26% in federal prisons. That’s what I was referring to. I did not—I misspoke when I said “prisons.†I was referring to the federal prisons, because that’s the federal crime: immigration. And that—
AMY GOODMAN: Have you made a correction on your show to say that 30% of—?
LOU DOBBS: I’m sure we have. We’ve reported—absolutely.
AMY GOODMAN: We didn’t see it.
LOU DOBBS: Do you know how many reports we’ve done on illegal immigration in this country?
AMY GOODMAN: Yes, many.
LOU DOBBS: I mean, my god.
JUAN GONZA***: Yeah, but I’d like to get into this issue—I mean, aside from the fact that the GAO report—
LOU DOBBS: Excuse me, just one second.
JUAN GONZA***: Sure.
LOU DOBBS: I mean, what if I were to sit here and just hound you because you said I was anti-immigrant, when I am, point of fact, I’m anti-illegal immigrant, and it’s absolutely a matter of fact. We could quarrel over the terminology, if you want. But why should people of good faith and intelligence sit there and be so absurd about it?
JUAN GONZA***: No, we agree on that. But this is precisely the lumping of illegal or undocumented immigrants and legal immigrants in one category that’s a problem—
LOU DOBBS: Right.
JUAN GONZA***: —because, for instance—
LOU DOBBS: Right, I agree with you.
JUAN GONZA***: —the total percentage of the non-citizen population of the United States right now is about thirty-five million, 12% of the population.
LOU DOBBS: Do you know this?
JUAN GONZA***: Well, this is Census Bureau—
LOU DOBBS: I was just—I was just—
JUAN GONZA***: Wait, wait, Lou. Let me finish. Let me finish, Lou.
LOU DOBBS: I have to say, I was laughing about the NIE, because, as you heard Steve Hadley talk about—
JUAN GONZA***: Lou, let me finish.
LOU DOBBS: —high confidence levels in those estimates,—
JUAN GONZA***: Right, but let me—
LOU DOBBS: What do you suppose the confidence level is of the United States government in the number of people in this country illegally, the number of people—
JUAN GONZA***: We’re assuming now—the legal population is pretty well documented, right? But the—
LOU DOBBS: Documented, undocumented.
JUAN GONZA***: The legal immigrant population is pretty well documented. It’s about twenty-three million. And then you add maybe another eleven to twelve million of the undocumented population, and you get thirty-five million. The point is—my point is this: if 12% of the non-citizen population of the United States—non-citizens comprise 12% of the population. They comprise 6% of the prison population. That suggests to me that crime rates are far lower among non-citizen immigrants—legal and illegal—than they are among the general population of the United States.
LOU DOBBS: Can I ask you a question?
JUAN GONZA***: You have raised the issue of crime—you’ve raised the issue of crime in relationship to immigrants.
LOU DOBBS: Well, silly me, silly me. MS-13, all sorts of gangs. You know, the fact that Mexico is the largest source of methamphetamines, heroin, cocaine, marijuana entering the United States. Silly me for bringing up crack.
AMY GOODMAN: But, Lou—
LOU DOBBS: But may I ask you a question?
AMY GOODMAN: I think you agree—
LOU DOBBS: May I ask this question—
AMY GOODMAN: I think you would agree—
LOU DOBBS: May I ask this question—
AMY GOODMAN: —that facts matter.
LOU DOBBS: Of course, they do. Absolutely.
AMY GOODMAN: And so—
LOU DOBBS: I am an empiricist to the bone.
AMY GOODMAN: And so, if 6% of prisoners are immigrants—documented and undocumented—and you said 30% of prisoners, a third of the population of prisons in this country, are prisoners, it conveys a very different sense.
LOU DOBBS: Different meaning.
AMY GOODMAN: And as you’ve pointed out—
LOU DOBBS: I agree.
AMY GOODMAN: —you’ve done hundreds of shows on these issues.
LOU DOBBS: More than that. More like thousands.
AMY GOODMAN: And that reinforces the feeling that people have, who watch the show—
LOU DOBBS: So, your point is?
AMY GOODMAN: —either they believe you or—either they don’t believe you, or they believe you and are being fed wrong information.
LOU DOBBS: Well, I don’t—you know, I think it’s important for all of us, because, as you say, I’m—we’re all interested in the facts. So let me ask both of you, please, a question that seeks a fact: Does the United States government and do state governments inquire of their prisoners as to whether they are legal or illegal, and can they under the law? Or are these estimates that we’re talking about?
AMY GOODMAN: Well, if the government doesn’t know, how do you know?
LOU DOBBS: No, that’s as straightforward question.
AMY GOODMAN: How do you know?
LOU DOBBS: Well, because in the federal prisons, they are permitted to make a decision as to whether or not they can ask if they’re citizens or non-citizens, but cannot ask if they’re legal or illegal. So it is, at best, a projection. When Juan says eleven million to twelve million illegal aliens, you and I both know that the Bear Stearns study suggests twenty million people. There is no one in this country today—that’s why I referred to the National Intelligence—
AMY GOODMAN: And the Bear Stearns study has been critiqued over and over again—
LOU DOBBS: By whom?
AMY GOODMAN: —by the top economists.
LOU DOBBS: Oh, come on!
AMY GOODMAN: Bear Stearns study, saying it is wildly exaggerated, that their—
LOU DOBBS: The National Intelligence Estimate is closer probably on Iran today than it is on the makeup of the US population today. I mean, if you want to talk about this nonsense, I mean, that’s what it is.
AMY GOODMAN: Let’s go to break, and we’ll come back.
LOU DOBBS: Sure.
AMY GOODMAN: Our guest is Lou Dobbs. He is the well-known anchor of CNN Lou Dobbs Tonight and has written a new book called Independents Day. We’ll be back with him in a minute.
[break]
AMY GOODMAN: Our guest for the hour is Lou Dobbs, well known as the CNN anchor of Lou Dobbs Tonight. In May, the New York Times published a critical article about you, Lou.
LOU DOBBS: [inaudible]
AMY GOODMAN: It was called “Truth, Fiction and Lou Dobbs.†Columnist David Leonhardt wrote, “Mr. Dobbs has a somewhat flexible relationship with reality.†Leonhardt highlighted this profile about you that aired on CBS’s 60 Minutes.
LESLEY STAHL: One of the issues he tackles relentlessly is illegal immigration. And on that, his critics say his advocacy can get in the way of the facts.
LOU DOBBS: Tuberculosis, leprosy, malaria?
LESLEY STAHL: Following a report on illegals carrying diseases into the US, one of the correspondents on his show, Christine Romans, told Dobbs that there had been 7,000 cases of leprosy in the US in the past three years.
CHRISTINE ROMANS: Leprosy, in this country
LOU DOBBS: Incredible.
LESLEY STAHL: We checked that and found a report issued by the US Department of Health and Human Services saying 7,000 is the number of leprosy cases over the last thirty years, not the past three, and nobody knows how many of those cases involve illegal immigrants.
[interviewing Dobbs] Now, went to try and check that number, 7,000—we can’t. Just so you know—
LOU DOBBS: I can tell you this: if we reported it, it’s a fact.
LESLEY STAHL: You can’t tell me that. You did report it—
LOU DOBBS: No, I just did.
LESLEY STAHL: How can you guarantee that to me?
LOU DOBBS: Because I’m the managing editor, and that’s the way we do business. We don’t make up numbers, Lesley, do we?
AMY GOODMAN: A day after the 60 Minutes report aired, Lou Dobbs discussed the issue on his program with his reporter, the CNN reporter Christine Romans.
LOU DOBBS: Then there was a question about some of your comments, Christine, following one of your reports. I told Lesley Stahl we don’t make up numbers, and I will tell everybody here again tonight, I stand 100% behind what you said.
CHRISTINE ROMANS: That’s right, Lou. We don’t make up numbers here. This is what we reported. We reported: “It’s interesting, because the woman in our piece told us that there were about 900 cases of leprosy for forty years. There have been 7,000 in the past three years. Leprosy, in this country.†I was quoting Dr. Madeleine Cosman, a respected medical lawyer and medical historian. Writing in The Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons, she said: “Hansen’s diseaseâ€â€”that’s the other modern name, I guess, for leprosy—“Hansen’s disease was so rare in America that in forty years only 900 people were afflicted. Suddenly, in the past three years America has more than 7,000 cases of leprosy,†Lou.
LOU DOBBS: It’s remarkable that this—whatever, confusion or confoundment over 7,000 cases. They actually keep a registry of cases of leprosy. And the fact that it rose was because of—one assumes, because we don’t know for sure—but two basic influences: unscreened illegal immigrants coming into this country, primarily from South Asia, and the—secondly, far better reporting.
CHRISTINE ROMANS: That’s what Dr. Cosman told us, Lou.
LOU DOBBS: And, you know, in talking with a number of people, it’s also very clear no one knows, but nearly everyone suspects, there are far more cases of that. It is also, I think, interesting, and I think important to say, one of the reasons we screen people coming into this country is to deal with communicable diseases like leprosy, tuberculosis. The fact is, if we would just screen successfully, all of those diseases can be treated effectively, efficiently and relatively quickly.
AMY GOODMAN: That’s Lou Dobbs on the show. The source behind the claim that there was a spike of 7,000 new cases of leprosy was a controversial medical attorney named Madeleine Cosman. In 2005, she described undocumented immigrants as “deadly time bombs, because of the diseases they bring into the country.†Cosman, who died last year, has also been criticized for these comments she made about Mexican men.
MADELEINE COSMAN: Recognize that most of these *******s molest girls under age twelve, some as young as age five, others age three. Although, of course, some specialize in boys, some specialize in nuns, some are exceedingly versatile and rape little girls age eleven and women up to age seventy-nine.
What is important here is the psychiatric defenses: Why do they do what they do? They do not need a jail; they need a hospital. They are depraved because they were deprived in their home country. But more important is the cultural defense: they suffer from psychiatric cognitive disjuncture, for what does a poor man do if in his home country of Mexico in his jurisdiction if rape is ranked lower than cow stealing? Of course, he will not know how to behave here in strange America. This is thoroughly reprehensible.
AMY GOODMAN: Madeleine Cosman, that’s her quote. She actually is not a medical doctor. She’s a Renaissance author and scholar of sorts. Lou Dobbs?
LOU DOBBS: What would you have me say, Amy? Because what—the reality is what you don’t say, is that Leonhardt’s piece was filled with errors. Secondly, Madeleine Cosman, as we learned following that report in Physicians and Surgeons, the publication, is precisely what you styled her: she is a wack—or was a wackjob. But the New York Times didn’t know that, either. If you would read the obituary for Madeleine Cosman in the New York Times—have you done that, by the way? She died a year ago, which was, by the way, a year after we had used her as a source in a report, along with other people. Did you read that obituary? Did you find that the New York Times had come to basically the same conclusion we had, that she was a credible source? Because if you read that obituary, it is glowing and filled with plaudits for Madeleine Cosman. And so—
JUAN GONZA***: Well, but, Lou, I think the issue—
LOU DOBBS: But I must—no, no. I am going to say this—
JUAN GONZA***: The issue is that we, as journalists—
LOU DOBBS: To go through a body of
JUAN GONZA***: —all have our own responsibility to—
LOU DOBBS: No, listen to me, Juan—
JUAN GONZA***: No, no, no, no, no, Listen—
LOU DOBBS: —because at least we can have some civility—
JUAN GONZA***: Lou—
LOU DOBBS: —to go through this and try to convey that this is a body of work. I spoke for eight seconds after that report on tuberculosis and the screening of illegal immigrants into this country. For eight seconds. And you’re trying to project this as if it is reflective of a body of work. And that, I think, is—I think—
JUAN GONZA***: No, but, Lou, the issue—
LOU DOBBS: I would hope that you would be embarrassed by that.
JUAN GONZA***: No, Lou, the issue is—
AMY GOODMAN: You’re the managing director of your show—
LOU DOBBS: I am the managing director.
AMY GOODMAN: —and editor of your show.
LOU DOBBS: And let me ask you a question: how many—how many people are on the registry for Hansen’s disease in this country?
JUAN GONZA***: 7,000, total.
LOU DOBBS: It’s over 7,000, correct.
AMY GOODMAN: For thirty years.
JUAN GONZA***: For thirty years.
LOU DOBBS: Absolutely.
AMY GOODMAN: You said over the last three years because of illegal immigration.
LOU DOBBS: And what did we say? Did I say because of illegal immigration?
AMY GOODMAN: Yes.
LOU DOBBS: I said no one knows, but one assumes primarily, because they’re not being screened. That’s what the doctors at the Hansen centers were telling us. Secondly, the issue of—if you want to, I mean, explode eight seconds into a whole body of discussion, fine. The reality is, I think you would agree, that if we were screening illegal immigrants, as well as legal immigrants, we would probably have a **** of a lot less in the way of tuberculosis in this country, and Hansen’s disease.
JUAN GONZA***: OK, Lou, I’d like to get into—take this in a much deeper perspective than just the particular fact—
LOU DOBBS: I hope so.
JUAN GONZA***: —because I’ve been very concerned about the lack of historical understanding of the immigration battles in our country, going back to the Irish in the 1840s. Father Joseph Fitzpatrick, who was a wonderful sociologist of Fordham University, once did a study of the criminal populations in New York City in 1859, concluded that 83% of all the criminal convictions in 1859 in New York City were Irish—were Irish, not Canadian, Scotch, English or Germans or the other bulk of the population in New York at the time, but were Irish, right? Henry McLaughlin, the—
LOU DOBBS: What in the world is your point?
JUAN GONZA***: Well, I’m getting to my point, but give me the time to do it. We have time on this show, unlike—we don’t do soundbites here, alright?
LOU DOBBS: No, and you certainly don’t do representative journalism, either.
JUAN GONZA***: Henry McLaughlin, Lou, was the guy who was the main consultant to the US Congress in developing the immigration restriction laws of the 1920s, a eugenicist who, interestingly enough, examined the facts—high crime rates among the immigrant population in the 1920s. Tuberculosis, disease, drunkenness—and these were the reasons—his studies of the population of the immigrant population were the basis upon which Congress decided on its restrictive laws to limit the number of southern Europeans, of Jews and of other nationalities that were coming into the country at the time. My point is that the issue of crime and the issue of disease has always been attempted by those who want to restrict immigration, right? But identifying—
LOU DOBBS: Juan, you’re smarter than this. I mean—
JUAN GONZA***: —with the immigrant population coming into the country.
LOU DOBBS: You’re smarter than this. You’re better than this.
JUAN GONZA***: You know, you’re doing the same thing that Henry—
LOU DOBBS: No, I’m—
JUAN GONZA***: —McLaughlin did in the 1920s—
LOU DOBBS: Oh, you’re—
JUAN GONZA***: —and the same thing that was done against the Irish—
LOU DOBBS: Juan, if you believe that—
JUAN GONZA***: —in the 1850s.
LOU DOBBS: If you believe that, you should look into that camera and say you apologize for trying to mislead people purposefully. The reality is this. Have you ever once heard me say anything other than I have the greatest respect for illegal immigrants in this country? Illegal immigrants. Forget immigrants, illegal immigrants. Have you ever heard me say anything other than that? Have you ever heard me say anything other than, I believe that the illegal alien in this entire mess is the only rational actor? Have you ever heard me say that? Have you ever read the transcripts of my broadcasts? Do you have any—
JUAN GONZA***: Yes, I’ve read quite a few of your transcripts. Not all of them, I have to confess. I work with—
LOU DOBBS: Would you like to tell me? Have you ever heard me say anything other than that? Have you ever heard me say that I want to have immigration restricted? I mean, my god, man, do you have any—any—sense of fidelity to the reality?
JUAN GONZA***: Yes, I do. And the reality is—
LOU DOBBS: How in the world can you use my name and “anti-immigrant†in the same breath?
AMY GOODMAN: When we hear comments like—
LOU DOBBS: You hear—
AMY GOODMAN: —a third of the—from you—we’ve played them, so we can’t refute the videotape, Lou.
LOU DOBBS: Have you looked, Amy—
AMY GOODMAN: We can’t refute—a third of prisoners are—
LOU DOBBS: Yes. And we discussed that?
AMY GOODMAN: —are illegal immigrants—
LOU DOBBS: Have we discussed it?
AMY GOODMAN: No, a third of prisoners are illegal immigrants, not true. 7,000 leprosy cases in the last three years because of illegal immigrants—
LOU DOBBS: Christine Romans misspoke—
AMY GOODMAN: —not true.
LOU DOBBS: —we said that. And that’s as straightforward as we can put it.
AMY GOODMAN: And you made an announcement on your show—
LOU DOBBS: Absolutely.
AMY GOODMAN: —and you will say it here—
LOU DOBBS: Absolutely.
AMY GOODMAN: —that it is not true. Illegal immigrants are not responsible for 7,000 cases of leprosy over last three years.
LOU DOBBS: Not over the last three years. But the likelihood is that illegal immigrants are responsible, because they are the ones who brought Hansen’s disease—
AMY GOODMAN: â€The likelihoodâ€â€”based on what, Lou?
LOU DOBBS: Based on doctors at the Hansen Center,—
AMY GOODMAN: No.
LOU DOBBS: —who said that—listen to me. Hansen’s—I mean, if you guys—you guys are just ridiculous in your loss of proportion here. You’re talking about one report. But if you want to talk about it, tuberculosis and Hansen’s disease are both screened, and they are so similar in the symptoms and their presentation that doctors look for that in the screening. Without question.
AMY GOODMAN: But as you agree now, you’re formally apologizing for having a presentation on your show—
LOU DOBBS: I already have.
AMY GOODMAN: —and then backing it up.
LOU DOBBS: Wait, wait, wait.
AMY GOODMAN: Again, this is not just one show.
LOU DOBBS: Referring to three years, OK?
AMY GOODMAN: So you’re saying that illegal immigrants have caused 7,000 cases of leprosy—
LOU DOBBS: No.
AMY GOODMAN: —over thirty years?
LOU DOBBS: I’m saying the likelihood is that those cases of Hansen’s disease are, according to the doctors at the Hansen Center, most likely as a result of illegal immigration, because they’re not being screened.
AMY GOODMAN: You know the fear—
LOU DOBBS: But why contain this?
AMY GOODMAN: Well, the reason—
LOU DOBBS: How |